------------------------------
Content-Type: text/plain

Loopers-Delight-d Digest                                Volume 96 : Issue 25

Today's Topics:
  Re: Drummers and Syncing              [ matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias  ]
  who controls the mix of the loops?    [ matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias  ]
  Re: Transcribing Loops.               [ "Louis Collier Hyams" <hyamsl@rpi.e ]
  Re: who controls the mix of the loop  [ Anton Chovit <antonc@earthlink.net> ]
  Re: Drummers and Syncing              [ RA336@aol.com ]
  Re: who controls the mix of the loop  [ RA336@aol.com ]
  Re: who controls the mix of the loop  [ RA336@aol.com ]
  Re: How does one Sync?                [ matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias  ]
  Re: Transcribing Loops.               [ matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias  ]
  Plex - JamMan syncing                 [ matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias  ]
  Re: Steve Reich & Musicians           [ Ray Peck <rpeck@PureAtria.COM> ]
  My contribution to the LOOP POOL      [ Ray Peck <rpeck@PureAtria.COM> ]
  Re: Steve Reich & Musicians           [ Paulpop@ssnet.com (Paul Poplawski,  ]
  JamMan odd time sigs                  [ <skhtmt@spiritone.com> ]
  attn: Portland and Northwest Loopers  [ <skhtmt@spiritone.com> ]
  Re: JamMan odd time sigs              [ "Greg & Sandee West" <gdwest@anc.ak ]
  Re: attn: Portland and Northwest Loo  [ improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) ]
  Re: Steve Reich & Musicians           [ improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) ]
  Re: Steve Reich & Musicians           [ pycraft@elec.gla.ac.uk (Dr ) ]
  Re:Jam Man Odd Time Signatures        [ ejmd@erols.com (Ed Drake) ]

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------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 16:52:10 -0300
From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Drummers and Syncing
Message-Id: <v01520d02aebf97d3e5ba@[200.254.32.110]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

RA336 said:

>I have spent 9 years in a band with two people looping with delays and two
>other people looping with samplers...

You are a rare case then. Tell us more!

>the delay-based loopers were me (stereo guitar>modified pcm42>jamman and
>>our violinist (stereo violin>tc2290>digitech 8 second delay)...

Of those machines only Jamman accepts MIDIsync, right?

>the sampler loopers were the drummer who generated his own loops and
>triggered his own click in a headphones setup... and the keyboard player who
>used sampled and sequenced loops. He would at times send midi clock to the
>drummer and to the delays in cases where we wanted hard sync.

So, how did he do that?

>Other times,
>mr. drummer was master of time and our subsequently perfomed looping
>synce-on-the-fly and previously created and sampled loops all somehow
>>managed to sit.

Wow! How that?

>We were and continue to be (I think) one of the very few song-oriented bands
>to be using techniques like these.

<uff> So it is possible. Sterile? Chaotic? The same as any band, just less
musicians?

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 16:52:24 -0300
From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: who controls the mix of the loops?
Message-Id: <v01520d04aebf9d5e3321@[200.254.32.110]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

RA336 said:

>Best thing to do though is have your own
>sound man, as a house guy who is unfamiliar with your act will have nary a
>clue as to what sound is coming from where...
>we fooled many

This is a serious question, maybe another subject for the Hints.
I guess you have the loopers with you on stage. So each player does his own
mix. And the technician can fix the result?
Or does each loop have a separate line to the desk?
And the monitoring?

Did anyone try to leave the looper at the mixing desk, use it for several
instruments with aux sends?
We could operate it through a mic line, each musician having a pedal board.
But the sound man would have to know which sends he has to open when how
much. Not simple.
Another way would be to mix on stage, maybe one of the musicians would play
less and care for this (with headphones maybe) and send the mix in two
lines.

Any experiences or sugestions?

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 14:14:33 -0500
From: "Louis Collier Hyams" <hyamsl@rpi.edu>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Transcribing Loops.
Message-Id: <9611251414.ZM7534@sparc.arts.rpi.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

matt!
what up...

did I ask you about the polysubbass gizmo?
such a beast would be useful to me.
still haven't reached your partner

howz the weather?

got much snow in NY. my great dane had never seen snow before this morning.
ever seen a 130 lb great dane scared of the snow?

collier

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 14:37:55 +0000
From: Anton Chovit <antonc@earthlink.net>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: who controls the mix of the loops?
Message-ID: <3299AEE8.540@earthlink.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Matthias Grob wrote:
> Another way would be to mix on stage, maybe one of the musicians would play
> less and care for this (with headphones maybe) and send the mix in two
> lines.
> 
> Any experiences or sugestions?

My brother Chris and I have developed a looping system based around one
or more mixers.  We run five echoplexs, three jammans and various effect
units off of the effect sends of our mixer.  Usually, the echoplexs and
jammans return to the main inputs.  This allows the looping and
effecting of loops, etc.  We run our instruments into the main inputs. 
We have gravitated to multibus mixers due to the ability to run each bus
to a different amp/speaker/physical location.  We started with a single
16 track alesis mixer.  This allows for up to six separate outputs
(using the monitor bus as channels 5 & 6).  We quickly outgrew the
inputs and moved to a 32 channel makie.  This allowed for up to 10
separate outputs.  This was not a very portable set up though.  Now we
are each using an alesis 16 track mixer.  We each control our own suite
of instruments/loopers/effects/amplification.  This allow for up to 12
separate outputs (six each).  If we run a snake between the mixers we
can process each other's loops and place them in each other's sound
field.  We are primarily playing guitar, bass, keyboards, sequencers. 
The guitars are played through small, high quality guitar combos and
feed a line out into the main mixer inputs.  This adds two or more sound
sources.

This may seem like an unmanigable system, but it is really easy to
control.  By varying the configuration and placement of the different
amp/speakers, a wide range of sonic variety is achieved.  We have mixed
PA speakers, guitar cabinets with 200 watt EV's and 25 watt green backs,
and other monitors with good results.  

We are feeling very comfortable with the current setup and it really
lends itself to real time performance. I can't stand to have to think
about the technology when I want to play.

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 21:41:41 -0500
From: RA336@aol.com
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Drummers and Syncing
Message-ID: <961125214139_1951128886@emout12.mail.aol.com>

Ok... I was perhaps a bit brief in my explanations... 
I'll get a little more informative here:

>>I have spent 9 years in a band with two people looping with delays and two
>>other people looping with samplers...

>You are a rare case then. Tell us more!

Enrapt with the textural possibilities of looping, (and being a
songwriter...) I decided early on to make it my mission to utilize looping in
every way available to me in order to expand the palette of the usual band.
Having an incredible electric violinist put us well into the game to begin
with tho...

>>the delay-based loopers were me (stereo guitar>modified pcm42>jamman and
>>our violinist (stereo violin>tc2290>digitech 8 second delay)...

>Of those machines only Jamman accepts MIDIsync, right?

that's right...

>>the sampler loopers were the drummer who generated his own loops and
>>triggered his own click in a headphones setup... and the keyboard player
who
>>used sampled and sequenced loops. He would at times send midi clock to the
>>drummer and to the delays in cases where we wanted hard sync.

>So, how did he do that?

The drummer, when triggering rythm-based loops would create a loop of a click
sample which would loop at the same rate as his "musical loop. He could
monitor all his samples and loops via a mixer in his own setup, and have his
"click loop" only show up at his mix, and not to the mix he sent out to the
desk.
When Mr. Keyboard was in charge of rythm-based loopage, it would likely be in
the form of loops which were created earlier and assembled in a hardware
sequencer... (much of the time, this would be samples of my guitar-originated
loops; but that's another item...) A track of the sequencer was dedicated to
sending a note on command- one per measure- to the drummer's sampler. This
would trigger the drummer's one-measure click loop, or rythmic pattern loop.
In addition, as long as the sequencer is on, it can be set to transmit midi
clock which can be read by the JamDude

>>Other times,
>>mr. drummer was master of time and our subsequently perfomed looping
>>synce-on-the-fly and previously created and sampled loops all somehow
>>managed to sit.

>Wow! How that?

Drummer's playing to a click, or to a rythmic loop he has created out of
samples. It's a short stretch to figuring out the temporal center, usually in
BPM's. Translate that to ms ad you have a basic, but generally very reliable
starting point as to how long your loop oughta be. I use the PCM42 for
ambient type loops and generally go with a "feel" thing as to how across time
I want that part of my material to flow... I would just get a general idea as
to where to be lenght-wise for each selection. Then again, when on top of
that you are using something like a JamMan or Echoplex, it's just a matter of
getting into practice in creating rythm loops on the fly... it goes back to
old studio techniques before they had any way of machine talking to
machine... they called it "wild syncing". 
(I've actually seen this done plenty of times in the studio where the
engineer will be bouncing tracks from one multitrac to another, with no form
of hard sync. It's cool and a little exciting, especially when it works;
which it can be made to do with practice...)

>>We were and continue to be (I think) one of the very few song-oriented
bands
>>to be using techniques like these.

<uff> So it is possible. Sterile? Chaotic? The same as any band, just less
musicians?

Definately NOT sterile. Lots of fun, and makes for some really thick,
beautiful extra-planetary stuff. As for chaos; what's wrong with chaos now an
agin? This goes to my original premise of trying to infuse hese elements of
strange, unusual and unorthodox into my songs....
... I get the sense this list is mostly instrumental-music people...
It just happens with me that I sing and writing for my voice is an important
parallel track I always consider when composing.
and no, -not- the same as any other band... that's always the point, aint
it?...

I'm suprised to see other monster-loopers not much talked about in this
forum. Jon Hassell, one of the true originators of the "instrument" does some
awesome stuff with his bands. There's also these really talented guys doing
this "street" type music with samples, turntables and stuff... incredibe, if
you ask me...

For those interested, I built most of the music for my last record pretty
much entirely from samples created from guitar loops. Here's the work flow:

guitar>guitar rig>jamman(receiving sync)>rackmixer outputs>speaker
emulator>sampler.

since I was creating my loops using a timing reference that was hard-synced
to the sequencer, it was just a matter of truncating my samples to have the
correct start-point. After that, it was a simple matter to lay the bits into
the track from the sampler. 
I actually got into working this way out of frustration with having no way to
store loops I created and wanted to work with. ie.: no dat machine...

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 21:47:37 -0500
From: RA336@aol.com
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: who controls the mix of the loops?
Message-ID: <961125214735_1319030602@emout06.mail.aol.com>

RA336 said:

>Best thing to do though is have your own
>sound man, as a house guy who is unfamiliar with your act will have nary a
>clue as to what sound is coming from where...


This is a serious question, maybe another subject for the Hints.
I guess you have the loopers with you on stage. So each player does his own
mix. 

- everyone does his own mix and sends it to the front, where the sound man
mixes as he thinks appropriate. This is where having someone who knows what
is supposed to be happening is a good idea...

And the monitoring?

- in my group, everyone monitors onstage

Did anyone try to leave the looper at the mixing desk, use it for several
instruments with aux sends?

- sometimes, with a real hip and well rehearsed sound man, this can happen.
He would probably need to be more or less a band member in that case; he's
contributing a little more on a musical level at that point...

Any experiences or sugestions?

- figure out the best way to monitor- especially for the drummer- and you are
practically there...
it's all in hearing what others are doing...

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 21:49:16 -0500
From: RA336@aol.com
To: antonc@earthlink.net, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: who controls the mix of the loops?
Message-ID: <961125214914_705997777@emout18.mail.aol.com>

wow Anton;
nice post. Really interesting approach you guys cooked up!

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 02:54:00 -0300
From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: How does one Sync?
Message-Id: <v01520d0caebfb734451a@[200.254.32.118]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Kim advised:
>There are a couple of other things you can do to keep your loops in sync in
>a live playing situation.
>
>One thing you can do is restart the loop from its beginning, at the
>appropriate musical point. So if you notice that your loop has drifted a
>bit from the rest of the band, you retrigger the loop so that it at least
>is starting from the right point. This isn't ideal if the tempo has changed
>slightly, but at least it gets things reasonably close together again if
>the loop (or the band) has drifted way off. In most rock contexts, you
>probably aren't going to have the loop repeating all that many times
>anyway, so a few readjustments of a bad loop will get you through a tight
>spot. I don't know if you can do this with other loopers, but with the
>echoplex you just hit Mute-Undo. (when you are in mute, Undo unmutes and
>starts the loop from the beginning.)

Since you might not want a hole in the music because of having to mute
before restarting the loop, you might set Sync to IN and use a footswitch
in the BeatSync socket . Whenever you hit it close to the loop end (or
beginning, this is so strange :-), it will restart at the beginning (or
end? %-/), correcting a bit.
And there were some other ones... Eric? Remember RestartOnlyBeatOne and stuff?

We could work out algorithms for this even. We had one that changed the
loop length. It was not usefull, because it started to stumble and get
clicky.
In the future we may be able to time stretch in real time and become able
to really speed up and down in real time, not just to sync.

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 03:54:42 -0300
From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Transcribing Loops.
Message-Id: <v01520d01aec039292f87@[200.254.32.114]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>matt!
>what up...
>
>did I ask you about the polysubbass gizmo?
>such a beast would be useful to me.

If you have a polyphonic pick up, definitally. If not, install one.

>still haven't reached your partner

Rolf? Did not talk to him either. Should be at 0041 52 233 34 43

>howz the weather?

rather hot, thanks. some more rain than usual. clima changes here, too. the
dry places in the interior are dryer even and at the cost heavy rain washes
roads and roofs away.

Matthias

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 03:56:03 -0300
From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Plex - JamMan syncing
Message-Id: <v01520d03aebf98e425d0@[200.254.32.110]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi,

Did anyone try to sync a JamMan with an Echoplex?
I do not have the specs of the JamMan but imagine that it should work...

Sooner or later, probably at a LOOP night (how do you call those planed
meetings/shows?) the problem will come up, I guess...

Just another way to go
Matthias

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 11:13:26 -0800 (PST)
From: Ray Peck <rpeck@PureAtria.COM>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Steve Reich & Musicians
Message-Id: <199611261913.LAA19829@pure.PureAtria.COM>

murkie writes:
>
>i agree wholeheartedly about reich's compositional superiority to glass
>(yawn).  

Another vote for Reich over Glass.  I find Glass horribly repetitive
(not in a good way).  To me, all his pieces "sound the same", in the
sense of using the same sort of harmonic movement.  I just can't
listen to it anymore.


Maybe one day I'll find an appropriate Reich piece, and make a tape of
Koyanisquatsi (sp?) with it dubbed in.  ;-)

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 11:50:55 -0800 (PST)
From: Ray Peck <rpeck@PureAtria.COM>
To: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob), Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: My contribution to the LOOP POOL
Message-Id: <199611261950.LAA25044@pure.PureAtria.COM>

Matthias Grob writes:
>Hi Ray!
>
>Did you get tapes?

I've gotten tapes from:

Studio Seventeen
Michael Peters
Patrick Smith

That's it, so far.

Remember folks, send that DAT in!  If you haven't recorded it yet, do
it on 44.1 so I don't need to do sample-rate conversion.

Ray Peck
24653 Summerhill Ave
Los Altos, CA 94024

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 21:42:11 -0500
From: Paulpop@ssnet.com (Paul Poplawski, Phd)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Steve Reich & Musicians
Message-Id: <v01520d02aec159b5b80f@[205.216.96.55]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>murkie writes:
>>
>>i agree wholeheartedly about reich's compositional superiority to glass
>>(yawn).
>
>Another vote for Reich over Glass.  I find Glass horribly repetitive
>(not in a good way).  To me, all his pieces "sound the same", in the
>sense of using the same sort of harmonic movement.  I just can't
>listen to it anymore.
>
>
>Maybe one day I'll find an appropriate Reich piece, and make a tape of
>Koyanisquatsi (sp?) with it dubbed in.  ;-)

Ummm .... Paul writes, cautiously

I am of the opinion that polarizing the work of Reich and Glass is
unnecessary.  They each have made contributions that have spirited Western
music composition and given it a much needed kick in the ass.  Whether
Glass is too much or too little of something or other relative to Reich is
immaterial in my view.  Koyanisquatsi as an underscore to the film is a
powerful piece for example.  Whether it should, or even needs to stand
alone, so what!  Reich and Glass utilize math in a slightly different way
... Reich is more division oriented while Glass more additive.  yadda,
yadda, yadda.  Einstein on the Beach is hallmark stuff ... I am sure he is
as surprised at his popularity as anyone.  I have seen both many times, but
I am by no means a disciple.  They have both made important contributions

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 21:43:18 -0800
From: <skhtmt@spiritone.com>
TO: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com>
Subject:  JamMan odd time sigs
Message-Id: <199611270543.VAA13022@ridge.spiritone.com>
Content-Type: text/rtf; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

{\rtf1\ansi\deff0\deftab720{\fonttbl{\f0\fnil MS Sans Serif;}{\f1\fnil\fcharset2 Symbol;}{\f2\fswiss\fprq2 System;}}
{\colortbl\red0\green0\blue0;}
\deflang1033\pard\plain\f0\fs16\cf0 Greetings all,
\par 
\par I have a friend who has a JamMan and is having trouble syncing (real word?) it up with his Alesis Drum machine while using odd time signatures.  The tune is in 7/8 and apparently, JamMan will only sync to a 2 or a 3, such as 3/4 or 4/4.  Any help regarding this problem would be vastly appreciated.  Reply via personal email if you don't want to clog up the list with all this tech talk.
\par 
\par Thanks.
\par 
\par D.G.
\par }

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 21:47:10 -0800
From: <skhtmt@spiritone.com>
TO: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com>
Subject:  attn: Portland and Northwest Loopers
Message-Id: <199611270547.VAA13165@ridge.spiritone.com>
Content-Type: text/rtf; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

{\rtf1\ansi\deff0\deftab720{\fonttbl{\f0\fnil MS Sans Serif;}{\f1\fnil\fcharset2 Symbol;}{\f2\fswiss\fprq2 System;}}
{\colortbl\red0\green0\blue0;}
\deflang1033\pard\plain\f0\fs16\cf0 93
\par 
\par L.A. is a little far away, don't you think?  Let's see about a Loop night in Portland!  Maybe Berbatis Pan, or some such.  Email me with info and let's set it up!
\par 
\par 93
\par 
\par Rev. D.G.
\par }

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 22:22:23 -0900
From: "Greg & Sandee West" <gdwest@anc.ak.net>
To: <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com>
Subject: Re: JamMan odd time sigs
Message-Id: <199611271031.BAA02954@anc.ak.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

Tell him to try doubling the meter (7/4 to 14/8 or 7/8 to 14/16) for
example.  If it has trouble syncing to odd numbers, you can probably make
it sync to even multiples of the meter.  Let me know if it works for him.

Greg West

------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 01:29:15 -0800
From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: attn: Portland and Northwest Loopers
Message-Id: <v01510103aec1b7228cda@[128.193.5.54]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>{\rtf1\ansi\deff0\deftab720{\fonttbl{\f0\fnil MS Sans
>Serif;}{\f1\fnil\fcharset2 Symbol;}{\f2\fswiss\fprq2 System;}}
>{\colortbl\red0\green0\blue0;}
>\deflang1033\pard\plain\f0\fs16\cf0 93
>\par
>\par L.A. is a little far away, don't you think?  Let's see about a Loop
>night in Portland!  Maybe Berbatis Pan, or some such.  Email me with info
>and let's set it up!
>\par
Yes! Count me in! As far as a venue, The "O", formerly the X-Ray, on
Burnside has a fairly open booking policy on weeknights. Of course,
Berbati's would be pretty cool if possible...

I'm willing to help however I can...

________________________________________________________
Dave Trenkel, NEW EMAIL ADDRESS: improv@peak.org
self promotional web-site: http://www.peak.org/~improv/
"A squid eating dough in a polyethelene bag is fast
and bulbous, got me?"
                                     -Captain Beefheart
________________________________________________________

------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 01:29:07 -0800
From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Steve Reich & Musicians
Message-Id: <v01510102aec114f9738f@[128.193.5.54]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>murkie writes:
>>
>>i agree wholeheartedly about reich's compositional superiority to glass
>>(yawn).
>
>Another vote for Reich over Glass.  I find Glass horribly repetitive
>(not in a good way).  To me, all his pieces "sound the same", in the
>sense of using the same sort of harmonic movement.  I just can't
>listen to it anymore.
>
Just yesterday I pulled out "Music for 18 Musicians", which I hadn't heard
in at least 6-7 years. I was surprised at how current it sounded, and at
how "electronic" some of the textures were. There was one point that
sounded all the world like a LFO-modulated analog filter.

>
>Maybe one day I'll find an appropriate Reich piece, and make a tape of
>Koyanisquatsi (sp?) with it dubbed in.  ;-)

Reminds me of a 20th Century music class I took. As a final project, one
student compared/contrasted the use of Phillip Glass's music in
Koyaanisquatsi with Ligeti and Penderecki's in 2001. He used the scene from
2001 where the astronaut is traveling into the monolith, with lots of
psychedic animation, accompanied, I believe, by a piece from Ligeti. At the
end of the presentation, he showed segments where he had swapped the music,
using Ligeti's under a Koyaanisquatsi segment, and Glass's under the
segment so badly described above. It was pretty startling. Koyaanisquatsi,
which I had always hated, became much more exciting, with the arythmic
music bringing out the irregular tempos of the filmmaking and editing. The
2001 segment, which is pretty striking usually, looked pretty silly, the
visual effects looking pretty dated. It proved a pretty interesting point
about how the music can affect our perception of visuals

________________________________________________________
Dave Trenkel, NEW EMAIL ADDRESS: improv@peak.org
self promotional web-site: http://www.peak.org/~improv/
"A squid eating dough in a polyethelene bag is fast
and bulbous, got me?"
                                     -Captain Beefheart
________________________________________________________

------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 17:23:00 GMT
From: pycraft@elec.gla.ac.uk (Dr )
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Steve Reich & Musicians
Message-Id: <1664.199611271723@rank-serv.elec.gla.ac.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>>murkie writes:
>>>
>>>i agree wholeheartedly about reich's compositional superiority to glass
>>>(yawn).
>>
>>Another vote for Reich over Glass.  I find Glass horribly repetitive
>>(not in a good way).  To me, all his pieces "sound the same", in the
>>sense of using the same sort of harmonic movement.  I just can't
>>listen to it anymore.
>>
>>
>>Maybe one day I'll find an appropriate Reich piece, and make a tape of
>>Koyanisquatsi (sp?) with it dubbed in.  ;-)
>
>Ummm .... Paul writes, cautiously
>
>I am of the opinion that polarizing the work of Reich and Glass is
>unnecessary. 

Especially the dissing Glass bit.  Let's be a little more openminded here,
folks!!

Michael
Who enjoys Glass.

Dr Michael Pycraft Hughes      Bioelectronic Research Centre, Rankine Bldg,
Tel: (+44) 141 330 5979        University of Glasgow, Glasgow G12 8QQ, U.K.
        "Everything in moderation, including moderation" (Zen Proverb)

------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 13:02:19 -0400
From: ejmd@erols.com (Ed Drake)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re:Jam Man Odd Time Signatures
Message-Id: <v01550100aec2146ba6a3@[207.96.100.57]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hello ,
      Sorry not to quote from the original messages, as I deleted them
before I responded. The subject was about the Jam Man  not allowing syncing
with an Alesis drum machine playing odd time signatures.

Well, there is way but not it's worth the trouble . You would have to
reprogram your drum patterns using step record and quantize say a drum beat
pattern in 5/4 to play within in the same time as a measure of 4/4 (or any
beat the Jam Man will recognize ). Do this by dividing the total number of
pulse per quarter notes (PPQ) for a measure of 4/4 ,which on the Alesis is
4 beats X 384(PPQ)= 1536 pulses per measure. Then divide this by the top
number of your time signature, 5 in this case, and that means that each
quarter note will occur at approximately 307 pulses apart and then you have
to step record everything in doing the math for eighths, sixteenths,etc.
Not a lot of fun in my book. I only know this from an incredible drummer
friend of mine who programs polyrhythms and tuplets etc. into his drum
machine and actually would rather step record as that's the only way he can
get some of these rhythms into his machine.

The Jam man only syncs up to 3,4 6,8,12,16,24 MIDI quarter notes in a loop.
I couldn't believe it didn't sync up to at least a few fairly common odd
times other than 3 such as 5,7, and maybe even 11 and 13.

This was one of my big complaints to Lexicon when I first got my Jam Man. I
spoke to them about it as a possible update and was told they would record
my request for inclusion in a possible future software update.     I used
to call them every couple of months to see if anything was up but nothing
has come of it and according to John Durant's post a while back they aren't
planning on doing any upgrades.

I got my Jam Man when they first came out and I really wish in retrospect I
had known the Echoplex was coming out as I might have waited to check it
out, but I had been looking for some kind of looping device for a long time
and I didn't even hear of the 'Plex for at least 6 months after I had my
Jam Man. Oh well, I'm still saving my pennies and dreaming.

One question for you 'Plexers , do any of you use MIDI instead of the
footswitch to control your Echoplexes .
I'm sure the MIDI implementation is extensive for the 'Plex but I  haven't
heard any of you talk much about it.


                             Here we go Loop de Loop              Ed Drake

--------------------------------