------------------------------
Loopers-Delight-d Digest				Volume 97 : Issue 164

Today's Topics:
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ Steven Dubofsky <skullsaw@gti.net> ]
  Re: looping in Thessaloniki           [ Morgan Fisher <morgan@gol.com> ]
  Re: Good Ole Fashioned tape looping   [ landman@wco.com (Mark Landman) ]
  Re: looping in Thessaloniki           [ Chris Chovit <cho@newdream.net> ]
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ Dave Stagner <dstagner@icarus.net> ]
  Re: Good Ole Fashioned tape looping   [ " frivolous" <frivolous@mailexcite. ]
  Re: Good Ole Fashioned tape looping   [ "Matt McCabe" <mattm@bi-tech.com> ]
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ Thom Heileson <heileson@u.washingto ]
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ Thom Heileson <heileson@u.washingto ]
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ "Matt McCabe" <mattm@bi-tech.com> ]
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ Thom Heileson <heileson@u.washingto ]
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ Dave Stagner <dstagner@icarus.net> ]
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ Pete Koniuto <pkoniuto@bu.edu> ]
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ Todd Pafford <todd@galen.dyn.ml.org ]
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ Kim Flint <kflint@chromatic.com> ]
  Re: Ultra lo tech looping             [ cdeupree@interagp.com (Caleb Deupre ]
  Re: delurking (was: belated LD bday)  [ Tom Lambrecht <hideo@concentric.net ]

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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 1997 10:42:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: Steven Dubofsky <skullsaw@gti.net>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.93.970928103713.17591D-100000@apollo.gti.net>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

> >I've been lurking here a while; I mostly use an EPS classic for my
> >looping, which is lo-tech enough, but this cassette method was something
> >I and a parnter played with a few years ago. Something about its
> >rawness, and its limitations actually seemed conducive to interesting +
> >unexpected outcomes. Sort of akin to a Surrealist game/experiment
> >technique.
> 
> 
> One idea could be (when I'll get my Echoplex I'll try this) to use
> prerecorded dat and cassette material to inject in the looper loops, while
> playing (I was thinking to volume pedals to control the output of the
> tapes). Could be interesting to have a mixer full of sound sources to let in
> at some moment in the loop (prerecorded tapes, radio, voices, other
> instruments, the crowd in front of you). Kind of casual interaction between
> your playing and the moment.
> Any comment about the role of caos and casuality in loop playing?


This is something I do a lot of. I will load my meager S-220 sampler with
1 second riffs, drop them an octave or more to get a longer phrase length
and then using midi volume commands bring the individual samples in and
out of the mix. I get patterns that take forever to repeat themselves as
well as very strnage timbres due to the aliasing caused by dropping the
samples in pitch. In my S-220 I can have 4 samples going and I'll throw in
4 more, longer samples, from my Amiga and just play the mixer. 

Todd Rundgren did some intersting mixer playing on his A Cappella album
where he had his voice sampled at different pitches and he used the mixer
as his keyboard.



steve d           
         

          Avoid using Skullsaw in excessive heat or humidity
        or where he may be affected by direct sunlight or dust
          
                     http://www.gti.net/skullsaw

------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 1997 23:55:42 +0900 (JST)
From: Morgan Fisher <morgan@gol.com>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: looping in Thessaloniki
Message-Id: <l03102800b0542f54d64f@[202.243.51.251]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Curtis Bahn wrote:

>Jam man and echoplex DP driven by interactive MAX algorithms
>LiSa by STEIM

Aha - LiSa! I just got hold of a demo (for those who don't know, this
program turns your Mac into a sampler) but haven't had time to try it yet.
Do have any comments about LiSa? Is it complex to use compared to regular
samplers such as the Akai, etc? Any special features worth mentioning?

Hope your performance is a great success, Curtis!

Morgan Fisher





>From Morgan Fisher, Tokyo
Email address:  morgan@gol.com
Second email address:  morgan_fisher@ringo.net

------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 1997 10:35:22 -0700
From: landman@wco.com (Mark Landman)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Good Ole Fashioned tape looping
Message-Id: <v01540b00b0544515651a@[206.155.55.30]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

The poster who was interested in a one-machine looping device should talk
to Paul Dresher when he's back,

I saw him perform in person about 15 years ago (at Macy's dept. store!!!)
with a 4-track tape machine doing wonderful 4 channel looping, using a
Casio keyboard as input fodder.

Mark

>
>- I started making one-machine loop devices in the early sixties (before
>echo-plex) -  anyone interested can contact me directly at:
>
>     timetunnel@fredmarshall.com/
>

------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Sep 1997 17:59:57 +0100
From: Chris Chovit <cho@newdream.net>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: looping in Thessaloniki
Message-Id: <v03007800b0543ccfb54a@[1.1.1.9]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>Jam man and echoplex DP driven by interactive MAX algorithms
>LiSa by STEIM

Interesting...What is the extent on the Echoplex DP control, using this MAX
patch?  Is it just for syncing, or does it send out commands too?  Is it
free/share ware?  If so, where can one download it?

Thanks in advance,
chris

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 10:25:59 -0500 (CDT)
From: Dave Stagner <dstagner@icarus.net>
To: "Thom S. Heileson" <heileson@u.washington.edu>
cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, dstagner@icarus.leepfrog.com
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.970929101638.10248A-100000@icarus.icarus.net>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Lo tech looping? These days, I mostly "loop" on an acoustic guitar!  I
start with some simple repetitive sound, then add another sound, and
another, and another.  The "loop" length of each sound varies, but the
pattern is the same.  So what I get is a textural improvisation, involving
layers of unique sounds in repeating patterns... looping.  All with no
electronics whatsoever.  

Mick Karn, who often plays bass with David Torn, uses a very similar
technique on fretless bass.  Wonderful lines.  It starts with just a
couple of notes, and eventually grows into a blur of slides, pops, and
snorts.  

I must confess, though, that I'm starting to itch for electronics again.
If I can find the time, I might build a nice stereo tube amp for my
acoustic guitar, something that complements the tone.  

And finally, I've been listening lately to a fairly primitive looping
album... "The Big Industry", by Roger Miller.  It was the start of his
"Maximum Electric Piano" work.  He used a Yamaha electric baby grand (the
kind with strings), with Cage-style preparations, a volume pedal, and a
couple of fuzz boxes for a tone source.  For looping, he used a simple
analog delay and a classic E-H 16 Second Delay.  Amazing stuff.

-dave

By "beauty," I mean that which seems complete.
Obversely, that the incomplete, or the mutilated, is the ugly. 
Venus De Milo.
To a child she is ugly.       /* dstagner@icarus.net */
   -Charles Fort              

------------------------------
Date:	Mon, 29 Sep 1997 08:50:53 -0700
From:	" frivolous" <frivolous@mailexcite.com>
To:	"Loopers-Delight Postings" <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com>
Subject: Re: Good Ole Fashioned tape looping
Message-ID: <PEFOLEAFMPLEAAAA@mailexcite.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Length: 1129
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
>Has anyone managed to come up with a single machine system? Would this work; signal
hit the record head, using some kind of tape tension kluge, pull the tape some distance
away from the machine, pre-capstan, so that the distance between the record and playback
heads is increased. I've been messing with a Dokorder that I picked up a couple of
weeks ago and it seems to me this could work. Any ideas?

Well, what I have tried involves a three-head tape deck and a continuous cassette
(from an old answering machine). It didn't work, but I need to try it again, by finding
an old broken down deck:

Hopefully, I can simply swap the record and playback heads around, and that will
give me 30 or 60 seconds of unsynchronized delay. If necessary, I could add a speed
control too (even linked to a pedal?) Needs a mixer, too, and Dolby C (unless you
want retro lo-fi)...

cheers,


---
frivolous@mailexcite.com                 London, UK
http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/3242/
 See the XLChords Project - MS Excel does chords?




Free web-based email, Forever, From anywhere!
http://www.mailexcite.com

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 10:14:14 -0700
From: "Matt McCabe" <mattm@bi-tech.com>
To: <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com>
Subject: Re: Good Ole Fashioned tape looping
Message-Id: <199709291709.KAA22219@gw1.bi-tech.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

-----------------------------
Matthew Finley McCabe
Sales/Marketing Support

> From: Steven Dubofsky <skullsaw@gti.net>

> considering getting back into tape looping. Has anyone managed to come up

> with a single machine system? Would this work; signal hit the record 

Many years ago (I think I was in the 9th grade!!!!), I used my Dad's old
3-head Sony reel-to-reel for looping.  If I remember right, I just draped
the tape around a glass jar to keep the tension up.  Not very hi-tech I
admit, but it did work.  When the tension finally gave way the loop would
gradually slow down and stop.  Occasionally during playback the tape would
shift and whatever was recorded on the "other side" (tracks 3 & 4) would be
played back....backwards of course.  Needless to say, it yielded some
trippy and very haphazard results.  

Matt

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 14:08:59 -0700
From: Thom Heileson <heileson@u.washington.edu>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-ID: <343018EB.49EB@u.washington.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Leonardo Cavallo wrote:
> 
> >Sort-of related but not really -- has anyone here played with an ultra
> >lo-tech (and lo-fi) method of looping, i.e. hand-cut cassette loops?
> >
> >I've been lurking here a while; I mostly use an EPS classic for my
> >looping, which is lo-tech enough, but this cassette method was something
> >I and a parnter played with a few years ago. Something about its
> >rawness, and its limitations actually seemed conducive to interesting +
> >unexpected outcomes. Sort of akin to a Surrealist game/experiment
> >technique.
> 
> Sorry, the idea is really interesting but I didn't understand.
> Do you use 2 cassette recorder like Revox reels systems? Or is this not a
> real time looping (you cut the tapes before and then you play them at gigs)??

It could be used live but we used it in the studio; we took apart the
casing of a cassette, snipped out most of the tape, and re-inserted (w/
scotch tape!) into the casing in a loop (i.e. a Moebius strip). The
loops were only a few seconds long; it was through the layering of them
that strucure was built...

> Any comment about the role of caos and casuality in loop playing?

In terms of chaos, I wouldn't know where to begin discussing it in terms
of looping (and other experimental music techniques). It is definitely a
prime interst in my reasons / methods for looping, whether it be
sampling or tape-looping. Random insert/exit points can, essentially,
_create_ aesthetic beauty, i.e. chance is directing the creation of the
art.

Thom

-- 
     _   _ _                Thom Heileson
   //)) //^~                            heileson@u.washington.edu
  ((// //       
               http://weber.u.washington.edu/~heileson/index.html

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 14:15:09 -0700
From: Thom Heileson <heileson@u.washington.edu>
To: Dave Stagner <dstagner@icarus.net>
CC: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-ID: <34301A5D.3091@u.washington.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Dave Stagner wrote:
> Mick Karn, who often plays bass with David Torn, uses a very similar
> technique on fretless bass.  Wonderful lines.  It starts with just a
> couple of notes, and eventually grows into a blur of slides, pops, and
> snorts.

Nice to see Karn mentioned here; he's my bass god. A true genius imo,
who has created an amazingly unique style. And his mantra-like bass
patterns are, I think, rdefinitely elevant to looping
 .
Thom

-- 
     _   _ _                Thom Heileson
   //)) //^~                            heileson@u.washington.edu
  ((// //       
               http://weber.u.washington.edu/~heileson/index.html

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 14:45:05 -0700
From: "Matt McCabe" <mattm@bi-tech.com>
To: "Loop" <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com>
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-Id: <199709292140.OAA28186@gw1.bi-tech.com>
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

-----------------------------
Matthew Finley McCabe
Sales/Marketing Support

SunGard Bi-Tech Systems Inc.
890 Fortress Street
Chico, CA  95973
916.899.4348
http://www.bi-tech.com

> Dave Stagner wrote:
> > Mick Karn, who often plays bass with David Torn, uses a very similar
> > technique on fretless bass.  Wonderful lines.  It starts with just a
> > couple of notes, and eventually grows into a blur of slides, pops, and
> > snorts.
 
Karn loops?  Where?  What albums?  I own his last two solo albums and
haven't heard any bass looping....should I be listening more carefully?

Of course I deleted your original post so maybe it wasn't in reference to
looping at all.  Alas.

Matt

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 15:13:28 -0700
From: Thom Heileson <heileson@u.washington.edu>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-ID: <34302808.64D3@u.washington.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> > Dave Stagner wrote:
> > > Mick Karn, who often plays bass with David Torn, uses a very similar
> > > technique on fretless bass.  Wonderful lines.  It starts with just a
> > > couple of notes, and eventually grows into a blur of slides, pops, and
> > > snorts.
> 
> Karn loops?  Where?  What albums?  I own his last two solo albums and
> haven't heard any bass looping....should I be listening more carefully?
> 
> Of course I deleted your original post so maybe it wasn't in reference to
> looping at all.  Alas.

I think he was (and I was) using a loose definition of looping, i.e.
creating repeating patterns on the instrument through live playing.
Technically different than what is discussed here, but idealogically
similar in many ways...

-- 
     _   _ _                Thom Heileson
   //)) //^~                            heileson@u.washington.edu
  ((// //       
               http://weber.u.washington.edu/~heileson/index.html

------------------------------
Date: Mon, 29 Sep 1997 17:15:41 -0500 (CDT)
From: Dave Stagner <dstagner@icarus.net>
To: Loop <Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com>
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.970929171309.12060A-100000@icarus.icarus.net>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Mon, 29 Sep 1997, Matt McCabe wrote:

> > Dave Stagner wrote:
> > > Mick Karn, who often plays bass with David Torn, uses a very similar
> > > technique on fretless bass.  Wonderful lines.  It starts with just a
> > > couple of notes, and eventually grows into a blur of slides, pops, and
> > > snorts.
>  
> Karn loops?  Where?  What albums?  I own his last two solo albums and
> haven't heard any bass looping....should I be listening more carefully?

AFAIK, he doesn't "loop" in the digital delay sense.  What I meant was
that his lines tend to start simple, and grow increasingly complex through
added ornamentation and detail, which is repeated.  So in that sense, Karn
"loops" on bass, without additional electronics.  I use a similar
technique on acoustic guitar, and consider it looping.
 
> Of course I deleted your original post so maybe it wasn't in reference to
> looping at all.  Alas.

Depends on what you mean by "looping".  :}

-dave 

By "beauty," I mean that which seems complete..
Obversely, that the incomplete, or the mutilated, is the ugly. 
Venus De Milo.
To a child she is ugly.       /* dstagner@icarus.net */
   -Charles Fort              

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 1997 12:59:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: Pete Koniuto <pkoniuto@bu.edu>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-ID: <Pine.A32.3.96.970930121602.166725B-100000@acs5.bu.edu>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Mon, 29 Sep 1997, Dave Stagner wrote:

> Mick Karn, who often plays bass with David Torn, uses a very similar
> technique on fretless bass.  Wonderful lines.  It starts with just a
> couple of notes, and eventually grows into a blur of slides, pops, and
> snorts.  

Yes, indeed, this is very much how he comes up with some
of those irresistable bass lines.  I wish i could relate
to you folks what it was like witnessing Karn, Torn, and
Bozzio warming up during the Polytown recordings with
45-minute jam sessions.  For many of those pieces on the
album, Bozzio already had a solid idea what the drum
parts were going to be.  I remember the first night they
had everything set up and were finally going to get to
play together, with Bruce Calder (the engineer) tweaking
here and there.  Bozzio put on this CD of Senegalese 
drummers in the control room, to which everyone listened
intently.  Then they went out and jammed.

Like i said, Bozzio already had pretty set ideas of the
ostinato patterns he was going to use in the drum parts,
leaving room for improvisation.  But it was up to Karn and
Torn to lift these patterns and take them to a different
place (a city populated in three weeks?).

Dave, i thank you for nailing it right on the head.  I was
not that familiar with Karn's playing before those sessions,
only what Torn had said about him, that there was no other
bass player like him.  He would start out simple, fitting
in comfortably with what Bozzio was doing.  At first i 
thought, Nice groove, great tone, but nothing all that out
of the ordinary.  The dude's got chops.

Then Torn would come in, soaring in, above, underneath, and
around the "rhythm section".  The chemistry of all three
was instantly apparent, yet very unique, like nothing i had
ever heard.  I would try to keep my attention on the whole,
but it would drift from musician to musician, often to the
relation between two of them.

I realized then that Karn's simple little bass line groove
wasn't so simple any more.  He had added really hard thumps
in between Bozzio's kick drum beats, and pops and slides 
would seem thrown in at random to accentuate this or that,
but they kept coming back with some sick and twisted--yet
consistent--pattern.  It was as if he had a looping device,
but his "looping" was all happening in his head.  All the
little textural nuances building up, some even fading away
into the distance as more came in.  And though Bozzio had
developed his ostinato into something a little more, well,
Bozzio, and Torn was now playing flames with his guitar and 
creating loopage and sonic havoc everywhere, Karn's "loop"
was right there with it all, and it worked beautifully.
A true testament to Karn's incredible ear and his ability
to use it to his advantage in the most precarious of musical
situations.  He can hear and listen very, very well, and
this allows him to take chances with his playing.  These
risks lead to some of the most unique, innovative musicianship
i have ever seen or heard.


Pete Koniuto

-----------------
Music Library
Boston University
617-353-3705
pkoniuto@bu.edu
-----------------

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 1997 13:45:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Todd Pafford <todd@galen.dyn.ml.org>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.3.95.970930134124.6830A-100000@galen.dyn.ml.org>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Tue, 30 Sep 1997, Pete Koniuto wrote:
> 
> I realized then that Karn's simple little bass line groove
> wasn't so simple any more.  He had added really hard thumps
> in between Bozzio's kick drum beats, and pops and slides 
> would seem thrown in at random to accentuate this or that,
> but they kept coming back with some sick and twisted--yet
> consistent--pattern.  It was as if he had a looping device,
> but his "looping" was all happening in his head.  All the
> little textural nuances building up, some even fading away
> into the distance as more came in.  And though Bozzio had
> developed his ostinato into something a little more, well,
> Bozzio, and Torn was now playing flames with his guitar and 
> creating loopage and sonic havoc everywhere, Karn's "loop"
> was right there with it all, and it worked beautifully.
> A true testament to Karn's incredible ear and his ability
> to use it to his advantage in the most precarious of musical
> situations.  He can hear and listen very, very well, and
> this allows him to take chances with his playing.  These
> risks lead to some of the most unique, innovative musicianship
> i have ever seen or heard.
> 
> 
> Pete Koniuto

Wow Pete, you really paint a mouth-watering picture. Where can I pick up
an album of these three playing together?  I'm a fan of Bozzio from his
days with Zappa, but haven't picked up on Torn or Karn yet.  Please tell
me there's an album of this musical magic (madness?) out there somewhere.
:) 

---
Todd Pafford
galen@erols.com (preferred)
todd@galen.dyn.ml.org (expect bounces)

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 1997 10:50:47 -0700
From: Kim Flint <kflint@chromatic.com>
To: Todd Pafford <galen@erols.com>, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970930175047.006ebc84@pop.chromatic.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 01:45 PM 9/30/97 -0400, Todd Pafford wrote:
>
>Wow Pete, you really paint a mouth-watering picture. Where can I pick up
>an album of these three playing together?  I'm a fan of Bozzio from his
>days with Zappa, but haven't picked up on Torn or Karn yet.  Please tell
>me there's an album of this musical magic (madness?) out there somewhere.
>:) 

it's called Polytown, released in 1994 on CMP records. Yes, it is a great album.

kim
_______________________________________________________
Kim Flint			408-752-9284
Mpact Systems Engineering	kflint@chromatic.com
Chromatic Research		http://www.chromatic.com

------------------------------
Date: Tue, 30 Sep 1997 14:15:59 -0400
From: cdeupree@interagp.com (Caleb Deupree)
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: Ultra lo tech looping
Message-ID: <19970930181558218.AAA181@NUDGE.interagp.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

>>>>> "Kim" == Kim Flint <kflint@chromatic.com> writes:

    >>  Wow Pete, you really paint a mouth-watering picture. Where can
    >> I pick up an album of these three playing together?  I'm a fan
    >> of Bozzio from his days with Zappa, but haven't picked up on
    >> Torn or Karn yet.  Please tell me there's an album of this
    >> musical magic (madness?) out there somewhere.  :)

    Kim> it's called Polytown, released in 1994 on CMP records. Yes,
    Kim> it is a great album.

Yes, it is great.  It's also out of print since CMP went under, so
grab them while you can.  This also applies to Torn & Karn's solo
albums for that label -- I'm having a heck of a time tracking down
What Means Solid, Traveler (and kicking myself vigorously for passing
it by a few months back).

---
Caleb T. Deupree
;; Opinions do not reflect on management

Computers are useless.  They can only give you answers.
(Pablo Picasso)

------------------------------
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 1997 23:19:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Lambrecht <hideo@concentric.net>
To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com
Subject: Re: delurking (was: belated LD bday)
Message-Id: <199710020319.XAA13558@newman.concentric.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 12:55 AM 9/22/97 -0700, you wrote:
>ok, I totally forgot, but the Looper's Delight list had it's 1 year
>anniversary Sept 10. It's been a remarkable year, really. We've formed an
>amazing little community here with all sorts of interesting folk. 


I'll say--I signed on after a fellow didgeridu player mentioned LD a couple
of weeks ago--GREAT STUFF!

quick question about the DOD fx 94 pedal--I'm thinking of getting one, but I
think DOD has a reputation amongst guitarists as less than great--how do you
think this piece stands up against say some of the Digitech PDS and RDS
effects that I see posts about.

Allso what are the differences between the RDS xx00 series and the x.x Time
machines in the defunct Digitech lines--would these be  agood loop choice
while I wait for the dream Jamman/Vortex combo to knock on my door (anyone
got extras?)

Thanks again for all the info!

drone on~~~~~~drone on~~~~~~drone on~~~~~~~~drone on~~~~Tom
Tom Lambrecht  hideo@concentric.net

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