------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain Loopers-Delight-d Digest Volume 97 : Issue 31 Today's Topics: Re: Another new member [ "Hogan, Greg" ] MID-ATLANTIC LOOP SHOW [ jspeer@haverford.edu ] Live Show Phila, Tuesday Feb 11th... [ David Talento ] Re: Midi Sample Dump [ kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) ] Re: Another new member [ Fish ] Re: Multitrack looper (was: Loop fea [ Paolo Valladolid ] Re: Midi Sample Dump [ slot_head@juno.com (bret w moreland ] Stream on brother [ patrick@his.com (Patrick Smith) ] $199 Jamman ? [ ccohen@voicenet.com (Charles Cohen) ] VORTEX -- FAQ & REAL PERSONS' USERS' [ David Kirkdorffer ] Re: VORTEX -- FAQ & REAL PERSONS' US [ kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) ] for greg of lex [ andre ] Re[2]: VORTEX -- FAQ & REAL PERSONS' [ "Todd Madson" To: Loopers-Delight Subject: Re: Another new member Message-Id: <9702101442.AA22087@beryllium.lexicon.com> ---------- From: Loopers-Delight To: Loopers-Delight Subject: Re: Another new member Date: Sunday, February 09, 1997 5:14PM In reply to Fish saying: ... >I originally discovered this technique while playing about with a friend's >Roland tape delay and a wah-wah pedal but it's quite easy to reproduce with >the EB16. The basic theory is to take a sound, put it through a slowly >sweeping band pass filter, delay the signal, and then feed it back to the >start where it gets filtered, delayed and fed back again. > >Now, you're probably thinking this is a bad idea and will result in the >nasty howl around feedback which we're all familiar with having plugged an >output into it's own input after one spliff too many in the studio. But >it's the sweeping band pass filter that's the key here. As the filter only >lets through a certain range of frequencies and eliminates the others, by >the time the delayed signal is fed back to the input the filter will have >shifted frequency sufficiently to prevent the signal building up into that >nasty howl. Matthias replied: Did you try to use a compressor, maybe even in the feed back path? >Depending on the original sound and by adjusting various parameters you can >achieve a number of weird and wonderful effects. Play a big chord using >nice thick pad and pass it through the feedback loop and you get a >beautiful evolving swirl of sound as the various harmonics are picked out >and emphasized. Take a techno stab, played in time with the delay and your >riff takes on a life of it's own. Or a few Rhodes chords add a really >spacey dimension to a dub track. White noise textures also work well with >the feedback loop adding a lot of movement to the sound. And of course with >an electric guitar, which is what I first made the effect for, your average >solo will take right off into space! I would really like to hear this. I just tried to implement on the PCM80 with the M-Band algorithm, but it failed, because the filters have no Q and the feed back is limited to 100%, so its just fading filtered, which is nice, but not what you are telling us. And I am too lazy to create an analog external feedback :-) The Resonant Chord algorithm create something similar, right Greg? To which I reply: The Resonant Chord algorithm in the PCM80 does foldback delay voices through filters in the manner that fish has described. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone 617-280-0372 FAX 617-280-0499 email: ghogan@lexicon.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 11:53:16 -0500 From: jspeer@haverford.edu To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: MID-ATLANTIC LOOP SHOW Message-Id: <199702101650.LAA20556@acc.haverford.edu> Exciting event! Mark it on the calendar: *********************************** PHILADELPHIA/MID-ATLANTIC LOOP SHOW Saturday, March 22, starting 7:30 pm @ LionFish Coffeehouse, 614 N. 2nd St.,Phila PA (215) 829-9103, half block north of Spring Garden St. Probable cover: $5 (not set in stone) Prepare yourselves for an evening of looped music, all members of Looper's Delight mailing list. In no particular order: * Paul Mimlitsch: Chapman stick * Accidents Will Happen: guitar/bass/drum trio featuring Paul Poplawski * Charles Cohen: solo Buchla synth * Fingerpaint: trio from DC featuring Patrick Smith Come meet the performers and their equipment! I'll tell you right now that if this show is a success, we can expect to see more "Loop Shows" in the future. Right now they have no idea what I talked them into booking. This place has an absolutely great dinner menu, coffee, desserts, etc. The management would love to see a good turn out of food-buying audience, and that's really their measure of success. So this is my appeal for support of live loop music in Philly, something I'd personally like to see a lot more of. Please e-mail me with any questions concerning the show, directions, anything! More information and reminder notice will follow closer to the date. Jim jspeer@haverford.edu ********************** My Town: Philadelphia! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 12:18:34 -0500 (EST) From: David Talento To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Live Show Phila, Tuesday Feb 11th... Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Overdrive Date Master, Philly's Avant/Psychdelic/Indie/whatever band will be playing a free show at the Trocdero tomorrow night. Special guest the Hale Bopp Noise Ensemble open. Overdrive Date Master use tape loops, delays, tube record players, effects, analogue beatboxes and guitar synths, as well as children's toys and a windup monkey triggering live percussion. this show will feautre all new instrumnets and a special guest violinist from eth Lost art of Puppet Orchestra. Sets start at 10pm. No cover, 21+ The trocadero is located at 10th and Arch street in Philadelphia. Come out a loop your asses off... -------- Help Wanted Productions - Bringing you the best in organic electronic and sweaty rock music since we started. Http://www.voicenet.com/~legion Available next month: "The Feedback Machine" a new studio album from the Music for Isolation Tanks live lineup. Only $6.00 postpaid! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 09:29:27 -0800 From: kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Midi Sample Dump Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 8:29 AM 2/10/97, Floyd Miller wrote: >At 11:18 PM 2/9/97 -0800, Kim wrote: > >>Best not to try the k2000...it won't be supported in the echoplex sample >>dump for a while, because it requires some special features that we have to >>add. If I remember right, the k2000 adds 200 to the sample #, and doesn't >>subtract it out again when you try to send back to the echoplex. The >>current echoplex soft doesn't like that much. It'll be there eventually. >> > >Ahhh. Yes the K2K does that. What does the Echoplex do with the >sample#? Does it use it to say which loop # ? Yes, I think that's right. Eric would know, since he's now written this code at least twice. Are you reading this Eric? When the new sample dump is finished, it will let you arbitrarily select loop#, sample#, and ID#. And no, I can't tell you exactly when that will be available, but progress is being made! kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:35:06 +0000 From: Fish To: "Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Re: Another new member Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970210173355.00692e74@mail.ndirect.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 09:31 10/02/97 -0500, Hogan, Greg wrote: >The Resonant Chord algorithm create something similar, right Greg? > >To which I reply: The Resonant Chord algorithm in the PCM80 does foldback >delay voices through filters in the manner that fish has described. The big limitation of my S2000 setup is that you're relying on an LFO to sweep the filter. Having control over the cutoff gives you far more creative possibilities. I've emulated the effect on a SY85 synth which has an effect called DFLTWAH (Yamaha don't provide any explanations for their acronymns). It's simply: delay->2 parallel filters->fedback to delay You get to assign one controller to modulate the cutoff frequency of the 2 filters (it can have a negative or positive effect on either filter), each filter has it's own cut-off point and resonance. So you setup the loop with max feedback and keep the controller moving to shift the filters. If you leave your foot controller still for too long the feedback gets louder (boosted by the Q). The swirly distortion textures you get at this point are kind of cool. Also, if you set the filters some distance apart and set the controller to have a positive effect on one, and negative on the other, you can play with 2 sets of harmonics and get some interesting effects as they crossover one another. This one needs a lot of fine tuning, but it's worth experimenting with. The SY85 doesn't have an analogue input so I'm sorry for you guitarists, but I'm only telling you in case you guys want to find a way to recreate it. Cheers Fish Fish fish@ndirect.co.uk http://www.ndirect.co.uk/~fish ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 10:52:01 -0800 (PST) From: Paolo Valladolid To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Multitrack looper (was: Loop features, FX processor) Message-Id: <199702101852.KAA12190@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Michael: > Naah... A MAC on top of a marshall stack does _not_ look good.... A Marshall stack would not be good anyway for the kind of looping I'd want to do, which would require more of a flat frequency response from my amplifier(s). A Mac Powerbook is small enough to be conveniently portable for gigs. Paolo ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 14:16:56 -0500 (EST) From: PainPete@aol.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Hello All (& is anyone still using Reel-to-Reel?) Message-ID: <970210134910_1247384264@emout10.mail.aol.com> Dear Fellow Loopy People, My name is Pete and I'm new to this list. I just wanted to say how happy I am that such a list exists. I've never felt much community spirit in loop-land, I've felt like I've been on a nearly deserted island. So it's nice to meet you all. Though primarily a guitarist, when I get sick of the guitar I start looping anything that moves, like synths, the sound of crumpling paper, garbage can lids banging, etc etc...I live in Seattle, hope to start arranging live shows soon to celebrate my fuctional-after-several-years-of-not-functioning guitar rig. I think the first loop I ever conciously heard was Lucier's "I am Sitting in a Room", though my loop obsession began with Fripp's "Let the Power Fall" and then later "The Heavenly Music Corporation" which I love dearly to this day. At the time I was fortunate to have access to two reel-to-reel decks and began experimenting with my own loops. The early loops were pretty much based on Frippertronics (guitar with pentationic minor scales) which rapidly got out of control as the reel decks were not in particularly good shape and getting the feedback just right was very hard. I usually got something like the end of "I am Sitting in a Room" pretty quickly. But I really dug that anyway. My nickname back then (and to some extent now) was "Painful" because I once did a radio show at the University of Vermont called "Swimming Pains in the Head", a sort of experimental noise journey which not coincidentally gave many people of non-like mind headaches. That title only lasted about six months, but the nickname stuck. So as a sort of joke, I started calling my loops "Paintronics" as opposed to "Frippertronics" (which I figure is also a bit of a joke on Fripp's part...) - That name stuck too, and sometimes for good reason it seems. (Is anyone else out there still using tape decks for this?) So nowadays I use a pair of Otari MX 5050 reel decks when I can get access to them (and try to get the best possible sound out of them too). I hope to buy my own sometime - Tape is my preferred medium - But on my guitar rack I have an already loaded-for-bear electronics setup fed through (don't laugh please) the Digitech Time Machine 8-second delay. It doesn't sound great but I have my Vortex after that in the chain which fleshes out the sound nicely (though I wish it could go first without sacrificing the nice stereo). I'd like the sound quality of the newer loopers but can't afford and don't quite trust them yet. (BTW glad to hear the Vortex has become an almost "cult" item due to its untimely and undeserved demise. However that does give us who are fortunate enough to have one a bit of a unique edge, does it not? I bet they'll be sold for vast sums in used stores as the legend grows, like old synths. Who knows?) Is there anyone out there into trading tapes? We talk much but the idea is to share music... Pete ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 11:36:46 -0800 From: Roland Eberle To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Hello All (& is anyone still using Reel-to-Reel?) Message-ID: <32FF78CE.61A3@sj.bigger.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit PainPete@aol.com wrote: > I think the first loop I ever conciously heard was Lucier's "I am Sitting in > a Room", For me it was Row Row Row your boat... I never got over it. Merrily merrily merrily merrily...life IS but a dream. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 00:23:56 -0500 (EST) From: andre To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: MID-ATLANTIC LOOP SHOW Message-Id: <199702110523.AAA27582@shell.monmouth.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" i'll certainly be tryin' to make this one !! good luck regardless....! andre (east) > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 10:54:49 MST From: slot_head@juno.com (bret w moreland) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Midi Sample Dump Message-ID: <19970211.110302.6735.1.slot_head@juno.com> Floyd wrote: But I guess unless the loop is really killer and irreplaceable, it may not be worth trying to save a 50 second loop via sample dump.. A digital audio recording might be good enough. Floyd, I find it quite practical and decent fidelity. I sometimes use a Dat recorder to save and reuse loops. I simply record the loop to Dat repeating it a few times so on playback I can get myself in sync for initiating record on the Plex or Jamman. Also by having several repeating copies of each loop I can verify how good I synced the copy from Dat back to Looper because after the copy both the Looper and the Dat are playing back simultaneously. If I did a good job syncing it sounds like a single source. If not it flanges, or worse echos. Best of all, it only takes a few reps of the loops to accomplish the dump to Dat and back again, rather than hours. bret ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 19:25:41 +0200 From: patrick@his.com (Patrick Smith) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Stream on brother Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Yo, Is the streaming audio files connected yet? I want to milk the ambient amd space music lists.........always looking to promo... Yur publicist, Chip :-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_-:-:_- Patrick Smith ..... Patrick@his.com .... ... .. . *** *** ** Fingerpaint http://www.his.com/~patrick/FNGP.html *** ** ^ ^ ^ ^^ ^ ^ ^ ^^ ^ ^ ^ ^^ ^ ^ ^ ^^ ^ ^ ^ ^^ ^ ^ ^ ^^ ^ ^ ^ ^^ ^ ^ ^ ^^ Solaris Guitar Trio .. .. . .. .http://www.xdc.com/solaris/ :-:-:_-:-:-:_-:-:-:_-:-:-:_-:-:-:_-:-:-:_-:-:-:_-:-:-:_-:-:-:_-:-:-:_-:-:-:_ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 00:59:37 -0500 From: ccohen@voicenet.com (Charles Cohen) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: $199 Jamman ? Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Could the person who has the GC ad for $199 Jamman's scan it and put it on the Loopers web site so anyone could download it and print it and use it to get a $199 deal from Musicians Friend? **** What's Charles up to? **** http://www.voicenet.com/~ccohen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 20:13:15 -0500 From: David Kirkdorffer To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: VORTEX -- FAQ & REAL PERSONS' USERS' GUIDE Message-ID: <33026AAB.58F9@AOL.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi folks. It's been a great thing to read the digests archive. It's a truely great way to catch up with loopy issues. Now -- I'm getting a VORTEX (at $160, how could I not?!). I've looked at the manual and I can see it's not going to be very helpful. And I've checked the presently existing VORTEX info at the Loopers-Delight Web Zone. It's quite good -- but seesm to stop... Questions: 1) Is there more VORTEX info that hasn't yet been "gathered" into this VORTEX summary zone? If so, are there plans to add it soon? 2) I remember reading somewhere there may be a "suppliment" to the little flip manual Lexicon supplies... Anyone got one that can be copied? 3) Any other VORTEX learning tips anyone care to share? Ever thankful this list of loopists exists. Looping in Boston. David Kirkdorffer SayAaahh@AOL.COM P.S. Any Boston loopists wanna get a "loop-a-ganza" together and play at upstairs at The Middle East? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 11:14:52 -0500 (EST) From: David Talento To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Anti-MIDI looping Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > >All my gear is pre-midi, I'm still using CV/gate, triggers, 24p clocks and > >FSK code. > > Being a guitar player, I only use gear designed in the past 5 years or more > than 40 years ago. I can't relate to technologies from the 70's, so I don't > know what you're talking about here. :-) Well I do know what you're talking about (I use all that stuff too) but I'm not sure what you mean. :) I use my echoplex live and just push the buttons on the front to get it to do what I want. Are you trying to sync it to something or just have it "play along"? I don't use any midi but I have three drum machines, a slew of processors and a couple cv/gate synths running. I have a submixer going into the echoplex and capture bits of the drums, do live tape loops with the EP by feeding it stuff form a cassette player live, and so on. It fits in rather nicely (we have one of the old 70's echoplexes as well) with all the other gear. I'd say it's a good tool for messing with the old stuff. I guess I should point out I don't want my tape loops synced to the beats as they are mostly vocals or spoken word tapes and I mess with them live a lot. > The plex can sync to pulses, using the BeatSync input. Does that help? My main clock is the standard Roland 24 PPQ Dinsync but I also have a divider running out from a CR8000 drum machine spitting out 24PPQ on a 1/4" jack (this triggers the gate on the synths) I've never tried triggering the EP from this although it *may* work. From what I gathered in the manual the Brothersync input was totally proprietary so I never looked to getting it "sync'd other ways. I didn't even know there was a "beat sync" input. really? I gotta get from behind my synths sometime and see what's going on in the rack more often. If this is what I think it may be it could proabbly take a +5 gate trigger from on of the old CV/gate sequencers or analogue synths. Hmmm, it might be worth a try... -------- Help Wanted Productions - Bringing you the best in organic electronic and sweaty rock music since we started. Http://www.voicenet.com/~legion Available next month: "The Feedback Machine" a new studio album from the Music for Isolation Tanks live lineup. Only $6.00 postpaid! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 01:39:28 -0800 From: kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: VORTEX -- FAQ & REAL PERSONS' USERS' GUIDE Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 8:13 PM 2/12/97, David Kirkdorffer wrote: >Questions: > >1) Is there more VORTEX info that hasn't yet been "gathered" into this >VORTEX summary zone? If so, are there plans to add it soon? That's one of the more popular spots on the site, actually. Seems to attract the search engines. There's a lot more uncollected vortex info in the archives, I believe. It's waiting for some enthused vortex owner to decide that they would really like to give something back to the vortex community by taking on this task..... well? any volunteers? kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 12:05:53 -0500 (EST) From: andre To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: for greg of lex Message-Id: <199702131705.MAA22286@shell.monmouth.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" hey greg hogan.. wussup with your email - i couldn't send you directly. it keep looping back to me ! virtual echo...anyway - thanks a million - got the package in the mail. You rule !! >andre (east) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Feb 97 11:55:36 CST From: "Todd Madson" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, ToddM@lasermaster.com Subject: Re[2]: VORTEX -- FAQ & REAL PERSONS' USERS' GUIDE Message-Id: <9701138558.AA855863810@ccmailgate.LaserMaster.Com> Kim: Hello - Todd here again, remember me? I'm the guy who's going to be HTML'ing the applications notes for Vortex. I've been extremely busy at work after my week or so absence due to the flu and all my projects have been put into disarray. I was going to actually be having the applications notes and/or my collected observations be an unofficial FAQ of sorts. The basics of this are still at http://www.waste.org/~crash/index.html however, I need to get cracking and finish it. Again, it's been a back burner project due to the way life is turning at the moment. It's also put my song for the CD on the back burner as well. Ack! Anyway, I'll soon get to work on collected info for the site as well as a FAQ of sorts. Todd Madson _______________________________________________________________________________ Subject: Re: VORTEX -- FAQ & REAL PERSONS' USERS' GUIDE From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com at Internet Date: 2/13/97 3:40 AM >Message was resent -- Original recipients were: To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com-------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------- At 8:13 PM 2/12/97, David Kirkdorffer wrote: >Questions: > >1) Is there more VORTEX info that hasn't yet been "gathered" into this >VORTEX summary zone? If so, are there plans to add it soon? That's one of the more popular spots on the site, actually. Seems to attract the search engines. There's a lot more uncollected vortex info in the archives, I believe. It's waiting for some enthused vortex owner to decide that they would really like to give something back to the vortex community by taking on this task..... well? any volunteers? kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com Received: from spica.LaserMaster.Com by ccmailgate.LaserMaster.Com (SMTPLINK V2.10.08) ; Thu, 13 Feb 97 03:40:38 CST Return-Path: Received: from ferret (ferret.slip.net [207.171.193.6]) by spica.LaserMaster.Com (8.7.3/8.6.9) with SMTP id DAA12050 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 1997 03:51:54 -0600 (CST) Received: from lists by ferret with local (Exim 0.57 #1) id 0vuxhu-00047I-00; Thu, 13 Feb 1997 01:43:58 -0800 X-Sender: kflint@pop.slip.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-mailer: Eudora Pro 2.1.3 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 01:39:28 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) Subject: Re: VORTEX -- FAQ & REAL PERSONS' USERS' GUIDE Resent-Message-ID: <"ZyYr3D.A.LzD.DIuAz"@ferret> Resent-From: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Reply-To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/2100 X-Loop: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: SmartList Resent-To: ToddM@lasermaster.com Resent-Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 01:43:58 -0800 --------------------------------