------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain Loopers-Delight-d Digest Volume 97 : Issue 46 Today's Topics: Re: New Roland Guitar Synth - Reacti [ Robert van der Kamp ] New on list [ Robert van der Kamp ] New on list [ Robert van der Kamp ] Re: New Roland Guitar Synth - Reacti [ KelRey@aol.com ] Re: New on list [ kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) ] Re: VG-8 (was New Roland Guitar Synt [ zenchi@juno.com (Robert L Williams) ] Re: echoplex manual/vortex&jamman ma [ kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) ] New Roland Guitar Synth [ verner ] Re: wake up! [ kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) ] Help!!! Audio software! [ finley@ecst.csuchico.edu (Matthew F ] RE: echoplex manual [ "Hogan, Greg" ] Philly loop show reviews? [ Adam Levin ] the loopy stylings of Giles-Kreuter [ ] Re: Help!!! Audio software! [ Jim Coker ] Mixer suggestion [ "Ott, John" ] Phila Loop Show big success [ jspeer@haverford.edu ] Administrivia: Looper's Delight **************** Please send posts to: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Don't send them to the digest! To subscribe/unsubscribe to the Loopers-Delight digest version, send email with "subscribe" (or "unsubscribe") in both the subject and the body, with no signature files, to: Loopers-Delight-d-request@annihilist.com To subscribe/unsubscribe to the real Loopers-Delight list, send email with "subscribe" (or "unsubscribe") in both the subject and the body, with no signature files, to: Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com Check the web page for archives and lots of other goodies! http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html Your humble list maintainer, Kim Flint kflint@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Mar 1997 21:55:48 +0100 From: Robert van der Kamp To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: New Roland Guitar Synth - Reactions? Message-ID: <333598D4.6F1501B3@pi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit PainPete@aol.com wrote: > > ( Sorry I'm missing the model # ) - Has anyone heard this unit? I've heard > that it actually builds waveforms upon the signal of the guitar itself, no > simple triggering (I am not speaking within my expertise here, so forgive me > if this is wrong somehow). I guess it uses the new physical modeling > approach. Would anyone care to venture an opinion? > > (I ask because I'm waiting for the ultimate guitar synth to do loops with!) Hi, I guess you're talking about the VG-8, an relatively expensive unit using Rolands new COSM technology. I never heared it, though. They say its *very* fast indeed. Robert ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Mar 1997 22:00:34 +0100 From: Robert van der Kamp To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: New on list Message-ID: <333599F2.2B772B30@pi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all, My name is Robert van der Kamp, I'm from Holland and I just suscribed on the list. I *never* did any looping, but I promise you this will change. :) I'm about to buy me an Echoplex (seems like the best choice?), and I was wondering if there any tricky details to keep in mind when buying a (used) model. Will I always be able to do software updates (which is great, btw), or do I need some modern model? (Don't even know if there *are* any different models). Thanks, Robert ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Mar 1997 22:00:44 +0100 From: Robert van der Kamp To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: New on list Message-ID: <333599FC.661AF86F@pi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all, My name is Robert van der Kamp, I'm from Holland and I just suscribed to the list. I *never* did any looping, but I promise you this will change. :) I'm about to buy me an Echoplex (seems like the best choice?), and I was wondering if there any tricky details to keep in mind when buying a (used) model. Will I always be able to do software updates (which is great, btw), or do I need some modern model? (Don't even know if there *are* any different models). Thanks, Robert ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Mar 1997 17:29:51 -0500 (EST) From: KelRey@aol.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: New Roland Guitar Synth - Reactions? Message-ID: <970323172950_-670543107@emout09.mail.aol.com> I have a VG-8 and really like it. It not only gets close to emulations of other guitars and speaker combinations but it can create its own unique sounds. It works on taking the vibrations from the string rather than midi info. For more info go to Rolands page. Kelly ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Mar 1997 16:28:58 -0800 From: kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: New on list Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Hi all, > >My name is Robert van der Kamp, I'm from Holland and >I just suscribed on the list. I *never* did any looping, >but I promise you this will change. :) Welcome Robert! > >I'm about to buy me an Echoplex (seems like the best choice?), >and I was wondering if there any tricky details to keep in >mind when buying a (used) model. Will I always be able to do >software updates (which is great, btw), or do I need some modern >model? (Don't even know if there *are* any different models). Well, for looping, you want to be sure you are getting the Oberheim Echoplex Digital Pro, and not the old tape based Echoplex delay unit from the early 70's. Sometimes when you are buying used it's hard to tell which one the seller has. There is only one model of the Oberheim Echoplex. You will be able to do software updates to it as long as there is someone making software for it, and at the moment, someone is... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Mar 1997 19:58:20 EST From: zenchi@juno.com (Robert L Williams) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: VG-8 (was New Roland Guitar Synth - Reactions?) Message-ID: <19970323.175926.3926.1.zenchi@juno.com> On Sun, 23 Mar 1997 21:55:48 +0100 Robert van der Kamp writes: >PainPete@aol.com wrote: >> ( Sorry I'm missing the model # ) - Has anyone heard this unit? I've >>heard that it actually builds waveforms upon the signal of the guitar >>itself, no simple triggering (I am not speaking within my expertise here, so >>forgive me if this is wrong somehow). I guess it uses the new physical modeling >> approach. Would anyone care to venture an opinion? >> (I ask because I'm waiting for the ultimate guitar synth to do loops with!) > >Hi, >I guess you're talking about the VG-8, an relatively expensive >unit using Rolands new COSM technology. I never heard it, though. >They say its *very* fast indeed. >Robert > > Definitely speaking of the VG-8. I have heard it (on the demo CD) and played it. I like it so much, I'm trading or selling most of my rig to get one. The distortions are a little buzzy and not very open, but usable. This is based on playing in a music store, so with tweezing I'm sure the presets can be improved on. The only other thing I don't like is the lack of MIDI control. It caught my attention because of the ability to tune each string over a +/- 1 oct range, the multiple guitar/pickup models and the Harmonic Restructure Modeling (HRM). There is a recent upgrade which adds new guitar, pickup,and amp models as well as a few new control features. I plan to use some unreplaceable pedals in the straight guitar loop and run the VG-8 outputs into a Vortex and stereo mic pre (any suggestions?) to feed a p.a. I have an extra copy of the demo cd that I'll give up for postage and a cassette of original music. BTW, is anyone interested in starting a tape tree? And what's happening with the CD? Robert Williams DERISION ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Mar 1997 17:55:09 -0800 From: kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: echoplex manual/vortex&jamman manual Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 4:39 AM 3/23/97, Stew Benedict wrote: >I don't know how far Travis is on the vortex manual project. But I've >got a scanned version I did while back for another looper who had one >with no manual. I don't want to get into any copyright problems with >Lexicon (Thoughts Greg?), but I could make this available. > >Stew Benedict Why don't you two collaborate on it? If you guys can manage to get it into a pdf file that is not unreasonably large, that would be perfect. The best way to do that is with the original files, rather than from a scan. Hey Greg, any chance Lexicon would let us use the original manual files to make nice digitized versions for the Looper's Delight site? Also, is it ok to put them up there? (I can't imagine why it wouldn't be ok, since it would only be helping you guys out. Might even reduce the customer service call volume a bit, huh?) kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Mar 1997 21:05:41 -0500 From: verner To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: New Roland Guitar Synth Message-ID: <3335E175.6C06@epix.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Glad there was mention of the Roland Guitar synth - GR-30. I'm currently reviewing one for Recording magazine. I've only had a chance to work with it a few times, but it's very nice. Looks just like the previous one, the GR-09. Roland has worked on the tracking and it rarely glitches! It's very clean. Response time is very good. Roland also has included an arpeggiator and harmonist. And there are a ton of sounds (more than the GR09 including the expansion board). Even better is that the price is very reasonable - I think it lists for $895. Sounds are good too. Needless to say, I like it. Anyone interested can email me for Recording's publication date, probably around July. J. Arif Verner Infinite Sound http://www.epix.net/~verner/ PS - My Web Site has other tech articles I have published - including a bunch on guitar synthesis. Check it out! PPS - By the way, synths are great for looping too! Has anyone tried it? It's wonderful, but it really should be in stereo. I used synths loops on my last album using the Yamaha D5000 (a very interesting box!). ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Mar 1997 19:38:44 -0800 From: kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: wake up! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Almost forgot to reply to this one: At 11:31 AM 3/14/97, MiqSk8@aol.com wrote: >i've noticed a lot of silence on several lists this week... > >well i finally got my manual, but have had zero time to implement. did manage >to find 4megs of memory out in the garage to up my plex to 50 sec, it's gonna >be fun. > >i have to agree about the pedal- so far the best luck i've had recording has >been to hold it down the entire time and then up to end. in stocking feet >sitting down! kinda surprised by this-is this sensitivity level common? Using a pedal with a looper just takes some practice, I think. You have to learn to tap in time with loop you want to create. When I've demo'ed the plex to people and let them try it, I've often been surprised at how many don't realize that the taps to start and stop the loop are musical events, and must be in time. A lot of people tap the record and start the loop, and then start playing some time after. Or they will stop playing the phrase they want to loop, and then tap the record switch to end the loop after a leisurely pause. Practice it a bit, you'll get the hang of it. >another random thing flew by me as well-kim, matthias, was there a reason for >either a 16mb limit on 30 pin simms or not using 72 pin simms? silly minds >want to know. I don't think 72 pin simms were even available when the echoplex hardware was designed. Or maybe they were brand new. Is that a good reason? An amazing thing to realize: when the plex first came out, 4MB SIMMs cost about $200 each. So at the time it cost $800 to upgrade an echoplex to the full 200 seconds. As you might imagine, there were not a lot of people willing to do that! (although a lot of users did, actually) So that is one reason for the 16MB limit. At the time, it was extravagantly large. Another reason is technical, since the address space of a 68000 just isn't nearly as big as newer processors. We probably could have worked around that somehow, but there didn't seem to be much point. The same 4MB simms are now available in my local computer/electronics store (fry's) for $17. So fully upgrading an echoplex now costs less than $80! Amazing. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Mar 1997 21:35:53 -0800 (PST) From: finley@ecst.csuchico.edu (Matthew F. McCabe) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Help!!! Audio software! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hello! I need a Shareware program for the Mac to convert the sample rate of audio files recorded with Logic Audio (Sound Designer type) *without* changing the pitch. Any ideas???? I'm trying to upload audio files (loops!!) to my web page and files sampled at 44.1kHz are just too large. Thanks! Matt ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 09:07:00 -0500 From: "Hogan, Greg" To: Loopers-Delight Subject: RE: echoplex manual Message-Id: <9703241436.AA29939@beryllium.lexicon.com> Stew said:"I don't want to get into any copyright problems with Lexicon (Thoughts Greg?), but I could make this available." I doubt that there would be a problem as long as no profit is involved. I will look into this with the folks in charge and get back to you. Best regards, Greg Hogan Lexicon Customer Service Phone 617-280-0372 FAX 617-280-0499 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 11:43:39 -0500 (EST) From: Adam Levin To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Philly loop show reviews? Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Does anyone who attended the Philly loop show care to share their impressions of the show? By impressions of the show, I don't mean: "TwangWooooWOOOOOOwOOOOOoooooBEEEEEPTwangWooooWOOOOOOwOOOOO..." 8) -Adam --- "...if one strives at hearing for the sake of constant virtue, out of seeking liberation from cyclic existence, gradually one becomes a Hearer." - Chandrakirti ------------------------------ Date: 24 Mar 97 11:47:36 EST From: To: Subject: the loopy stylings of Giles-Kreuter Message-ID: <970324164736_702420.204300_BHD44-27@CompuServe.COM> ---------------------------- Forwarded with Changes --------------------------- From: Russell Gorton at CreatSvc-Ada Date: 3/24/97 10:28AM To: INTERNET:dsclmc@ix.netcom.com at CSERVE To: INTERNET:scottb@pmeasuring.com at CSERVE To: INTERNET:Jsteve00@aol.com at CSERVE To: INTERNET:tbalx8548k@aol.com at CSERVE To: INTERNET:rahl_s@supplytech.com at CSERVE cc: Robert Barney at CommAdmin-Ada Subject: Giles-Kreuter ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Twe weeks ago I took delivery of an Echoplex Digital Pro (4 Mb/ 50.3 sec). It is by far the best piece of gear (meaning: most dramatic new impact on overall rig) in the rack. The Oberheim made its public debut last night to a surprisingly populated room at Planet Gong coffeehouse on the old North end of downtown Grand Rapids, MI. The venue is a very low-key place; some Tuesday nights they watch progressive videos (i.e. Yes, Genesis, Gong, Hawkwind) on the big-screen, Thursdays is Japanimation, Fridays is techno, there are rotating themed nights for movie buffs, etc. Typical 90's coffeehouse retro-style of rumpus room furniture, board games, etc. Owner is die-hard old Trekker who is hiding a Juno-8 in the basement. Anyway, my comrades Jameson and Joe dubbed our band "Giles-Kreuter" and we schlepped everything over there. Sound was provided by stereo mix from our Tascam 688 Midistudio (20x8 bus mixer/8-track cassette recording desk), which was OK by me 'cause I can control levels of _everything_. I think loopers enjoy running their own sound...is this true? Outputs ran on a looooooooooooooonnng RCA patch cord to the house stereo, which is a big surround-sound receiver running a 5-speaker system (essentially a home theater setup) -- but it worked well for the size room and ambience. Did I say ambience? Well, that's what we were there for. Ambient loops. Straight up, no chaser. "Uh...are you guys kind of like...uh...industrial?" "No." Anatomy of looping-friendly setup: Inputs Mixer Effects Loops chan. Korg Polysix 1 Korg monoSynth 2 Wavestation L 3 aux send 1 --> Oberheim Echoplex Wavestation R 4 eff ret 1-2 <-- loops Condenser mic 5 aux send 2 --> Korg A3 <- Les(s) Paul Akai Tube mic 6 eff ret 3 <-- effects <- fretless bass SM-57 mic 7 Effects ret 4 8 ---> always sent to aux 1 for looping effected Pre-taped tracks 9 signals A crazy set-up and certainly cordfuck all over the place, but it worked beautifully. Notes: Korg analog synths were crucial for creating the Klaus Schulze-esque backdrop of swirling oscillating waveforms. We improvised a crude note-holding feature on the monoSynth, namely, shoving a matchbook between keys so it holds the switch closed. That frees up the keyboard-playing hand to concentrate on wave modulation (knob-twiddling) while the other hand lights your cigarette. Korg Polysix (a grand old keyboard, 6-oscillators and a zillion fun knobs to play with) often locked into very slow arpeggiated chord pattern, cutoff knob amply rotated. Nice to see these features have been brought back on the awesome new Roland J?-8000 model synth. Microphones were variously deployed for capturing (for loops, of course!) harmonica, egg shakers, shortwave radio, Skeletor toy microphone, throat gargling, tin whistle, Honeycomb Hideout code-tapper toy, etc. One of the Korg A3 effects outputs went back into a main mixer channel, so I could then send it selectively to the Echoplex loop. The other output came back into the effects return path, for straight signal of guitar (cheap Les Paul copy) and bass, which were both preamped and effected only by the A3 (we were really leaning on that A3, but it sure beats luggin' separate, dedicated guitar/bass amplifiers) Pre-taped tracks included direct-from-television samples of the guy who sells getrichquick schemes ("by placing thousands of TINY classified ads in newspapers ALL OVER the country, YOU TOO can make MILLIONS of dollars, JUST LIKE I have...") -- looped 50 secs by Echoplex and burned to a tape track earlier that day -- and other nonsense. Guitar/bass featured the magic of the E-bow. Great for creating hollow drone loops, preferably with a big, thick, "1964 BAC-111 taxiing for take-off" flange ladled over. Best part of this band is 1) being able to get up and chat with audience during show, i.e., leave the command center of mixing board, keyboards, effects rack, pile of mics and noisemaker shit, and walk around a little; while loops, samples, and arpeggiators fire away.... and 2) that GREAT feeling you get when: Slacker/choade kid walks over at that moment: So, are, like, you....um...guys gonna play? Joe: Can you say that again? Slacker/choade kid: Oh...is this shit all on and making that noise? Oberheim: "Oh...is this shit all on and making that noise?.....Oh...is this shit all on and making that noise....Oh...is this shit all on and making that noise?....Oh...is this...." Yes, it's certainly wonderful when you're _that_ close to performance art that people aren't even sure you're making music. Validation was when we finished and a techno/trace CD went on the stereo. People thought it was STILL us. Somehow, inexplicably, it was worth moving all the gear. Hell, they even wanted us to come back! And we even got free coffee...wow. At least it keeps the smoke out of my apartment, for a change. Rt "_loving_ that Echoplex...it's the chiz" Gorton ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 18:29:04 +0100 From: Robert van der Kamp To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: New on list Message-ID: <3336B9E0.28020A0F@pi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kim Flint wrote: > > >Hi all, > > > >My name is Robert van der Kamp, I'm from Holland and > >I just suscribed on the list. I *never* did any looping, > >but I promise you this will change. :) > > Welcome Robert! :) > > > > >I'm about to buy me an Echoplex (seems like the best choice?), > >and I was wondering if there any tricky details to keep in > >mind when buying a (used) model. Will I always be able to do > >software updates (which is great, btw), or do I need some modern > >model? (Don't even know if there *are* any different models). > > Well, for looping, you want to be sure you are getting the Oberheim > Echoplex Digital Pro, and not the old tape based Echoplex delay unit from > the early 70's. Sometimes when you are buying used it's hard to tell which > one the seller has. There is only one model of the Oberheim Echoplex. You > will be able to do software updates to it as long as there is someone > making software for it, and at the moment, someone is... Oops! Didn't know about the tape based plex. Good tip! :) Good thing, these updates. Thanks, Robert > kim > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint | Looper's Delight > kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html > http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 11:39:54 -0800 From: Jim Coker To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Help!!! Audio software! Message-ID: <3336D88A.E15@interaccess.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Matthew F. McCabe wrote: > > Hello! > > I need a Shareware program for the Mac to convert the sample rate of audio > files recorded with Logic Audio (Sound Designer type) *without* changing > the pitch. Any ideas???? > > I'm trying to upload audio files (loops!!) to my web page and files sampled > at 44.1kHz are just too large. > > Thanks! > > Matt Well, you could use Sound Designer II to do it, i think, but that's not shareware. Or a hack I just thought of is to connect the mac's sound out ports to the sound in ports and record from there at a lower rate. For shareware, try sound machine. Look for it at shareware.com. jim ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 12:04:16 -0600 From: "Ott, John" To: "'Loopers Delight'" Subject: Mixer suggestion Message-ID: > I plan to use some unreplaceable pedals in the straight guitar loop and run the VG-8 outputs into a Vortex and stereo mic pre (any suggestions?) to feed a p.a. < I use a Mackie 1202VLZ, love it. My guitar signal goes to an Digitech RP-6 and I use it's cabinet simulator to send a stereo signal to the Mackie. My JamMan is on the Aux 1 out/return loop. Then I use the Aux 2 out to feed a Fender amp. Tape out and in go to my hard disk recording system (Mac with Deck II) Then the main outs got to the PA amplifier It also has a headphone and control room send with a fader. The aux returns have faders also. I also bring in two keyboards and microphones to the Mackie. (It has four XLR inputs with preamps for the first four channels (mono) also each channel has line level 1/4 jack inputs, The last four channels are stereo line/level (no preamps) 1/4 inch inputs) The Mackie was recommended to me by a trumpet player friend who likes the preamps. They are sweet but I like the Mackie for its flexibility. I can control how much of each channel I send to the JamMan with the aux 1 send faders on each channel. Each channel also has three band eq. It's rack mountable if you need that. I'm using mine in a home studio so It's on a desk next to Mac. You can get one for about 310-350 bucks if you check around. I love this mixer. good luck john John Ott Information Technology Manager Alliant Techsystems, Inc. Advanced Technology Applications 401 Defense Highway Annapolis MD 21401 (410) 266 1743 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 1997 13:49:16 -0500 From: jspeer@haverford.edu To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Phila Loop Show big success Message-Id: <199703241849.NAA08508@acc.haverford.edu> Hi folks, The Mid-Atlantic Loop Show, held this past Saturday, 3/22, was a resounding success! The four acts thoroughly entranced the appreciative and eager audience, and a bigger night of entertainment could not have been found anywhere else that night, and certainly not for 5 bucks. Speaking for myself, I had the greatest time listening to the performers, who came through in a big way that night, living up to and exceeding all expectations. I'm reluctant to provide a review of the music, since I'm hardly a disinterested party. If anyone out there from the list attended the show, please post your comments, as I'm sure there are many out there (including me) waiting to hear. Beyond the sheer beauty of the music, it was simply one of those nights where everything goes right. Even I hadn't anticipated the huge volume of equipment which was loaded into and stacked up in the coffeehouse (let's just say that a lot of oxygen was displaced), and it was a true miracle that the stage changes-over worked out so smoothly and efficiently. The audience was happy, the performers seemed happy to me, the venue owners were ecstatic. One important point is that we proved that such a thing is logically possible and commercially plausible. The LionFish owners would like to have more Loop Shows there in the future, so I can tell you all that, yes, I will likely be organizing a Loop Show II in the summer or fall. Until then I'll do my best to hook you loop acts up with other Philly venues and promoters. For those of you trying to get gigs in this town I hope you'll be able to point to the success at the LionFish in support of your efforts. There are at least a handful of people for whom this will mean something, and I am proud to have been a part of this small step forward. Big thanks to everyone who performed, attended or otherwise provided advise and support! One way or the other I look forward to hearing a lot more looped music in this town. Jim ********************** My Town: Philadelphia! --------------------------------