------------------------------ Loopers-Delight-d Digest Volume 97 : Issue 92 Today's Topics: Re: IPS-33B [ "T.W. Hartnett" ] Re: Digitech Delays [ Jef Veatch ] The LoOpDoctOrs scream HELP!!! [ mgsam@wave.net ] Re: Digitech Delays [ VanEyck ] Re: The LoOpDoctOrs scream HELP!!! [ Kim Flint ] Re: The LoOpDoctOrs scream HELP!!! [ mgsam@wave.net ] The LOopDoctOrs calm down... [ mgsam@wave.net ] gear schmear, music is best [ Kim Flint ] Re: E-bow [ ANET@aol.com ] Re: gear schmear, music is best --> [ Chris Chovit ] Recommended Recordings [ Mark@asisoftware.com (Mark Kata) ] interactive loops [ matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias ] Re: Lex PCM-80 [ matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias ] Re: Lex PCM-80 [ "Matt McCabe" ] Re: gear schmear, music is best [ Jim Coker ] Re: gear schmear, music is best [ Kim Corbet ] Re: Recommended Recordings [ improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) ] Administrivia: Looper's Delight **************** Please send posts to: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Don't send them to the digest! To subscribe/unsubscribe to the Loopers-Delight digest version, send email with "subscribe" (or "unsubscribe") in both the subject and the body, with no signature files, to: Loopers-Delight-d-request@annihilist.com To subscribe/unsubscribe to the real Loopers-Delight list, send email with "subscribe" (or "unsubscribe") in both the subject and the body, with no signature files, to: Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com Check the web page for archives and lots of other goodies! http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html Your humble list maintainer, Kim Flint kflint@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 97 13:07:13 -0000 From: "T.W. Hartnett" To: "Looper's Delight" Subject: Re: IPS-33B Message-Id: <199706181806.LAA28852@scv1.apple.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" >Has anyone used the Digitech IPS-33B Smart Shift as a looping device? Torn uses it in his instructional video to process his loops, and it sounds pretty cool. I don't think it can loop par se. I've been meaning to try one out, as there's one for sale locally that no-one's moving on, but I'm pressed for rack space. Travis Hartnett P.S. Just checked out the Digitech Whammy/Wah/Volume pedal. Very, very cool. I've got the original Whammy Pedal, and it's going to get bumped in favor of this--footswitchable presets (step up/down only, as opposed to the orignal's hand-requiring, difficult to read knob), stereo, six octave dives, blah, blah, blah. Still has hateful wall wart, but at least the case is metal. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 16:11:21 -0400 (EDT) From: Dpcoffin@aol.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Ufo´s delight Message-ID: <970618161118_-1731206692@emout18.mail.aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=unknown-8bit In a message dated 6/18/97 7:34:24 PM, you wrote: <> PLEASE say more about how you're using these deep and provocative devices as loopers. I'm assuming that the key difference between them and the dedicated guys like plex and JM is the richness of the delay programming possibilities, and the subsequent ways you can modulate and mutate whatever is rolling around in the delay feedback...but it's not at all clear what the real possibilities are, esp. since Lex. seems virtually uninterested in this aspect of delay-dom these days. Appreciate any and all clues, since on paper the expandable PCM-80 sounds extremely capable, but a much-anticipated audition of one in a rackety Sam Ash pro-audio dept today was neither enlightening nor very inspiring. Auditioning the add-on cards seems simply out of the question, and maybe that's the only reason I'm suspecting that the gold is in those upgrades. Thanks David ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 97 16:50:20 -0500 From: "C.H.Glansdorp" To: "Loop List" Subject: Re: IPS-33B Message-Id: <199706182048.QAA16862@brickbat8.mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" >>Has anyone used the Digitech IPS-33B Smart Shift as a looping device? > >Torn uses it in his instructional video to process his loops, and it >sounds pretty cool. I don't think it can loop par se. I've been >meaning to try one out, as there's one for sale locally that no-one's >moving on, but I'm pressed for rack space. The IPS-33B was my first harmonizer - I don't recall it having looping capabilities. It did have a basic delay system of I believe up to 2000ms (that could be fed back into the harmonizer for delayed/stacked arpeggiations, etc). I was using a Digitech RDS-8000 as my loop toy back then. +------------- | Christopher H. Glansdorp | Cellist/Electric Cellist +------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 97 16:57:18 -0500 From: "C.H.Glansdorp" To: "Loop List" Subject: Re: Ufo´s delight Message-Id: <199706182055.QAA26541@brickbat9.mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" >surprised that you people didn't talk to much about the brilliant loop >possibilities of the MPX 1.I am using the Jamman for my musicalbackings and >the PCM 80 and MPX1 for interactive loops and delays.>> > >PLEASE say more about how you're using these deep and provocative devices as >loopers. I'm assuming that the key difference between them and the dedicated >guys like plex and JM is the richness of the delay programming possibilities, >and the subsequent ways you can modulate and mutate whatever is rolling >around in the delay feedback I picked up an MPX-1 recently (finally getting rid of my old QuadraVerb), but am just starting to dig around this new box. I'd also be really interested in hearing how people are using the MPX-1, especially in conjunction with a dedicated looper. Fun stuff to explore while I wait for the Plex to arrive. -CHG- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 16:32:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Paolo Valladolid To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: John Stevens' Barrage Message-Id: <199706182332.QAA11147@waynesworld.ucsd.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > >Actually, the best looping show I saw at UCSD was by John Stevens, a > >guitar-playing maniac on the faculty. He does have a CD out, which I > >hope to get around to writing a review about someday. Needless to say, > >this CD has less to do with Fripp and occupies the more abrasive end of > >the tonal spectrum. > > > This sounds very cool, what's the title/label? The title is Barrage and the label is A Planet Of Loose Change The address given on the CD is 205 1/2 Park Ave. Long Beach, CA 90803-1748 John's email is jstevens@ucsd.edu I listened to the CD again. When I examined John's setup at the live show, he had two or three full racks of gear. The show took place before the release of the Jam Man or the Oberheim Echoplex so I don't know what he was using for looping. I would say the music has more in common with Fred Frith than with Robert Fripp; lots of feedback and "industrial" type sounds (jackhammers, sirens, etc.) by manipulating his guitar and effects in certain ways. Paolo Valladolid --------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ---------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 21:28:34 -0400 From: UFO WALTER To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Re: Ufo¥s delight MPX a Vortex? Message-ID: <199706182128_MC2-18C0-1D22@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Well a special thing about looping with the MPX is the way you can insert different effectblocks into the loop or the feedback of a delay.Maybe try program :119 Capture EQ It is a very basic loop,but it´s good to start with.If you go to options while you are in the loop- or delay edit,then you can choose an effect block into which the looped signal should run.I am using it with an expressionpedal,so i have direct cotrol over the level and fade in or out time.It is very good for layerd interactiv solostuff,when the jamman or whatever is busy with backingwork.It reminds me to the Vortex Deja Vu Algorithm.Whatever you do with Lexiconstuff,always try a footpedal and midicontroll.It gives total control. UFO ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 21:54:44 -0400 From: Jef Veatch To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Wall Warts Message-Id: <199706190154.VAA00917@server1.mich.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Lot of mention 'bout warts... I haven't seen the biggest reason *i* hate them. Hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Better than 80% of the 60 cycle i get in the gear i have is caused by these little buggars. I've found that an 8 to 12 inch seperation between an AC cord and audio cables will prevent transferring hum from the AC cord into the audio path. For wall warts, that distance is closer to 3 to 4 *feet*. At this point, i have a long power strip located in the corner of my music room that holds all of the warts. At least the enemy isolated. :-) By the way, for you equipment reps out there; wall warts *are* on my short list of why *not* to buy a piece of gear. There has to be a *strong* reason to over-rule that one. (like a JamMan for $200... :-) I would personally spend twice as much on a piece of gear that has a well shielded internal power supply. Not out of principle, but due to the fact that i don't consider any piece of "professional" audio gear that uses a device that creates 60 cycle hum (which *no* serious musician or engineer could possibly want) so profusely to be a piece of equipment that i would consider to be of any quality whatsoever. Whew... Do *i* feel better... -Jef ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 21:59:23 -0400 From: Jef Veatch To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Digitech Delays Message-Id: <199706190159.VAA01511@server1.mich.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" : : Does anyone know what the specs are for the various delays in the RDS series : OTHER than the time machine and -8000 units? In particular, I am interested : in the 900's, which I have heard possess a CV input. Any info? Anyone? : : While I'm at it, how about ANY older rack units with CV in? I have an old MXR rack mountable Flanger/Double (sounds great, less filling...) that has a CV input. Unfortunately, not being a keyboardist, i have no idea what range of voltage is kosher for this input. I haven't received a definitive answer from anyone yet, so i'll ask the list: What range of voltage is kosher for this input? :-) 'Preciate any feedback. -Jef ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 19:48:07 -0700 From: mgsam@wave.net To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: The LoOpDoctOrs scream HELP!!! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear Kim: We just tried to install the full 4 by 4 of SIMS into our Echoplex. AGGHGGGHGGHGG! The machine just went bonkers, blinking indecipherable code on the display and then shutting down. We have tried doing the hold down "parameter" button and turn on power reboot...but it isn't working. More gobledygook code. We bought 30 pin, 70 ns simms, but it doesn't seem to be working. We have one of the oldie Echoplexes with a sticker inside that says Dec. 1994. You have any ideas what we should try next? We have installed simms many times and are completely hip to anti static warnings. Best, The LoOpDoctOrs ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 23:04:36 -0400 (EDT) From: VanEyck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Digitech Delays Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Wed, 18 Jun 1997, Jef Veatch wrote: > What range of voltage is kosher for this input? :-) > > 'Preciate any feedback. Ummm, technically, any voltage that has been presided over by your local Vaad Hakashruth should do, but if you are still having problems I know a Rabbi who could find you a loophole for just about anything. TREVOR. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 20:52:58 -0700 From: Kim Flint To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: The LoOpDoctOrs scream HELP!!! Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970619035258.00a976a8@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" should work, somethin's busted! you might want to try: - make sure the simms are all the way in the sockets. sounds obvious but I've been there many times. - be careful installing/removing them. If you are using a significant amount of force, you stand a good chance of breaking something. you might want to put your old memory back in to make sure that the sockets are ok. - remove them and check the sockets to make sure all the contacts are healthy looking and that there is no debris or cooties in there. check the simm contacts as well. - Install one pair at a time and see if maybe you have a bad simm. - make sure they all really are 4 meg simms. If you tell me the part #'s on the chips and the number of chips/simm I could tell you. - return them for a different set or get plex repaired as necessary. - holding the parameter button at powerup probably won't help you here. That just resets the parameters stored in non-volatile memory. simm size is not related. - the mfg date of your echoplex has nothing to do with it. good luck..... kim At 07:48 PM 6/18/97 -0700, you wrote: >Dear Kim: > >We just tried to install the full 4 by 4 of SIMS into our Echoplex. >AGGHGGGHGGHGG! > >The machine just went bonkers, blinking indecipherable code on the display >and then shutting down. > >We have tried doing the hold down "parameter" button and turn on power >reboot...but it isn't working. More gobledygook code. > >We bought 30 pin, 70 ns simms, but it doesn't seem to be working. We have >one of the oldie Echoplexes with a sticker inside that says Dec. 1994. You >have any ideas what we should try next? We have installed simms many times >and are completely hip to anti static warnings. > >Best, >The LoOpDoctOrs > > > > > ________________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 23:45:11 -0700 From: mgsam@wave.net To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: The LoOpDoctOrs scream HELP!!! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi Kim: Thanks for your usual help and good graces. There's nothing obviously broken. I get a flashing "LD-3 3.1" code when I turn the unit on and then sometimes it just keeps blinking, while other times it shuts itself down. Eight chips on the SIMM and the code says: KOREA 414Y KM41C4000C3-7 These look used. I suspect a simm problem. Best, The LoOpDoctOrs ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 00:44:13 -0700 From: mgsam@wave.net To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: The LOopDoctOrs calm down... Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi Kim: Yep, BAD simms alright. Plugged in the old stuff and the Echoplex is acting normal. Incidentally, now that I have the thing open, I am going to attempt the pin cut mod and the gain mod. Do you have any favorite tools for the pin cut mod? I notice the #5 pin is a very tight squeeze. And are you simply desoldering and resoldering the resistors to modify the gain, or are you clipping them out and then soldering in? Best, Kevin ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 00:20:14 -0700 From: Kim Flint To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: gear schmear, music is best Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" jeez, we can be the biggest gear geeks on the planet some days! Somebody pleeeeez start an interesting thread about music...anything! I'd do it but i'm too busy and exhausted to think at the moment. anything but gear...... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 07:46:14 -0400 (EDT) From: ANET@aol.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: E-bow Message-ID: <970619074239_-1496093198@emout03.mail.aol.com> If you need equipment, I can order it for you at a good price and then ship it to you in France. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 07:16:04 -0800 From: Chris Chovit To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: gear schmear, music is best --> Loop dynamics Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > >Somebody pleeeeez start an interesting thread about music...anything! I'd >do it but i'm too busy and exhausted to think at the moment. anything but >gear...... > >kim OK....Lately, I've been listening to Terry Riley's "Dervishes" album. Now, I don't think he used looping devices on this stuff, but just performed the repetition manually. I am assuming that you all still consider this loop music, even though he performed the loops, rather than using a device. Steve Reich also falls into this category. Reich tends to slightly alter each loop (sometimes by one note at a time) after a certain number of repetitions. It seems that there are two extremes: Pure repetition and pure chaos. As loopists, we tend towards the pure repetition, but as it has been stated on this list, this is static and tends to be boring. The exciting part (for me, anyways, is the introduction of a perturbation into pure repetition, which propagates, and gives a dynamic or chaotic aspect to the music. For me, Steve Reich was a master at this. He played with slight alterations, especially in the melody, where he would develop a melody one note at a time, and then disintegrate the melody one note at a time. Different melodies would "rise and fall" in parallel, but with different start and end points. "Music for 18 musicians" and "Music for mallet instruments" are great examples of this. Often, I have played this music for people, and, upon first glance, they think it to be repetitive and boring. On the contrary, I love it because it is continually evolving. Each moment in time is related to past and future moments, but it is not the same! This is what I am trying to work towards. I am just now starting to explore the possibilities of the NextLoop function on the Echoplex DP. Has anyone experimented with loading a bunch of really similar loops in there, then changing between them with Next Loop function, to give the impresssion of movement, without a drastic change? Has anyone experimented with using MIDI commands (perhaps driven by a sequencer) to switch between the loops? Any startling revelations in this area? Also, anyone using interesting tricks with the feedback pedal to introduce dynamics? If so, please explain! (sorry if I reverted back to gear talk, kim...perhaps there is a "loop" quality to our talks, as well. Chris ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 10:15:02 -0400 From: Mark@asisoftware.com (Mark Kata) To: 'Loopers Delight' Subject: Recommended Recordings Message-ID: <01BC7C99.A87C7320@mark.asisoftware.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Earlier this year there was a long thread of posts about recordings that loopers requested. What new recordings do you recommend? (I really enjoyed learning about DJ Spooky from the last thread of posts.) Mark Kata Mark@asisoftware.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 13:11:49 -0300 From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: interactive loops Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Welcome Ufo ! >I am the German Demoartist of Lexicon.I am a >Bassplayer and do performances on international tradeshows. I think I saw you in Frankfurt in '94. Really good demo, as I mentioned to the list before! >the PCM 80 and MPX1 for interactive loops and delays. Never heard of interactive loops. Sounds great. How would you define? Matthias ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 13:12:03 -0300 From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Lex PCM-80 Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Anybody out there using this box as an occasional looping device? I >understand that it's no plex or JM, but the looooooong stereo delays and >sophisticated dynamic fx make it sound pretty impressive for a "sometimes" >looping setup. Comments? I wanted to use it to create pitch shifted repetitions and realized the none of the pitch algorithms has more than 1,2 sec of delay :-( The Tap/Rhythm definition is smart Matthias ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 09:25:47 -0700 From: "Matt McCabe" To: Subject: Re: Lex PCM-80 Message-Id: <199706191618.JAA05438@gw1.bi-tech.com> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > From: Matthias Grob > I wanted to use it to create pitch shifted repetitions and realized the > none of the pitch algorithms has more than 1,2 sec of delay :-( > The Tap/Rhythm definition is smart The Digitech GSP-2101 can do something similar to what you are describing. You can send the delay line (up to 5 sec I think) into the "arpeggio" module -- causing each repetition of the delay to be pitch shifted one step higher (or lower) than the previous. The fun begins when you have one arpeggio module pitch shifting down and the other pitch shifting up and then you add the auto panner module to each arpeggio line....Viola! -- you've got something that sounds very chaotic in a beautiful sort of way!! Matt ----------------------------- Matt McCabe Sales/Marketing Support BI-TECH Software Inc. 890 Fortress Street Chico, CA 95973 916.899.4348 http://www.bi-tech.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 12:03:17 -0700 From: Jim Coker To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: gear schmear, music is best Message-ID: <33A97CE3.2041@interaccess.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ok, how about this :) Anyone familiar with African M'bira music? A friend of mine just introduced it to me. Very nice ostinato-based. The notes are in patterns of 3, but the accompanying shaker beat is in 2. Jim Kim Flint wrote: > > jeez, we can be the biggest gear geeks on the planet some days! > > Somebody pleeeeez start an interesting thread about music...anything! I'd > do it but i'm too busy and exhausted to think at the moment. anything but > gear...... > > kim > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Kim Flint | Looper's Delight > kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html > http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 12:31:05 -0500 (CDT) From: Kim Corbet To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com cc: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: gear schmear, music is best Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Okay...good call. my latest inspiration came from sitting in a Dallas seafood bar several weeks ago. There were 3 hanging tvs at different distances, all tuned to different channels (one sports, one sitcom, one news station), plus two or three conversations and the guy calling out orders and numbers. It was, basically, a slightly chaotic texture with clear, disparate sources. As I changed my focus, I could change the nature of the "performance" and, when I walked around the space, I could, of course, manipulate the balance, drawing parallels of synchronicity through the polyphony. In our Dallas band, GOUGE, most of us have loopers and we've been working with the concept of selective listening. We may start off absolutely together, but, over time, we begin to separate in terms of tempo or tonal center or even style...adding megaphone speeches or theatrical events that stand in concert or contrast with any part of the overall. If music reflects life, it's nice to play/hear music that reflects the diversity of stimuli we're continuously faced with. It's becoming increasingly rare to do just one thing at a time and it's likely in the future we'll have tv, radio, even movies that include multiple images, multiple songs and multiple plots all at the same time. I believe loopers are ahead of their time in this regard with their ability to clone their own images. I'm looking forward to a device that creates holographic images of the performer that appear with each loop, so there's a "fan" of images standing there, building audio/visual textures....................................spare kim ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 11:02:26 -0700 From: Kim Flint To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Recommended Recordings Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Earlier this year there was a long thread of posts about recordings that >loopers requested. What new recordings do you recommend? > >(I really enjoyed learning about DJ Spooky from the last thread of posts.) > >Mark Kata >Mark@asisoftware.com In the dj spooky vein, I recently got Aphex Twin's new album, titled "Richard D. James Album." (that's his real name) It's really cool, sort of experimental electronica. a lot pushing the drum n' bass concept to a new place, while being very musical. Aphex Twin is always known for being very experimental and creative, this is one of his best albums. (at least as far as I know) A very interesting pallette of sounds, very creative rhythmic textures. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Jun 1997 11:09:50 -0800 From: improv@peak.org (Dave Trenkel) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Recommended Recordings Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Earlier this year there was a long thread of posts about recordings that >loopers requested. What new recordings do you recommend? > >(I really enjoyed learning about DJ Spooky from the last thread of posts.) > >Mark Kata >Mark@asisoftware.com One disc I like a lot, and have been meaning to recommend to this list, is Ned Rothenburg and Paul Dresher's "Opposites Attract", on New Worlds Countercurrents, 1991. Rothenburg plays alto sax, bass clarinet and shakuhachi, and is mostly associated with the downtown New York improvised music scene. Dresher is mostly known as a contemporary classical composer, but he's also a guitarist who has experimented with tape-based delays a lot. This record was recorded over several years, it started as a duet project with both of them using a custom 4 track tape looping system designed by Dresher. Eventually, many of these loops were transferred to samplers, and compositions constructed around them, and other musicians were added, including drummers Bobby Previte and Sam Bennet, and bassists Mark Dresser and Anthony Jackson. While most of the players involved in this project are associated with the avant-garde new music scenes, musics that I really dig but I understand are not everyone's bag, this record sounds more like the experimental instrumental rock of, for example, Torn's last CD. In fact, in places it sounds like a funkier version of '80's King Crimson, with a very resourceful reeds-player substituting for Adrian Belew. Anyway, I've listened to this disc a lot over the last 5 years, and it still holds up. Lots of very cool loops. Also, I've been listening to some CD's on the Ninja Tune label. Very cool atmospheric acid jazz/drum 'n' bass built around great funk and jazz loops. In particular, I like the "Earthrise.Ninja.2" compilation, a very reasonable priced 2 CD set that features about 2 1/2 hours of great stuff. Also, Funki Porcini's "Love, Pussycats and Car Wrecks" is quite cool. One piece is built around a loop of Ornette Coleman. Not quite as brilliant or far-reaching as DJ Spooky, but in the same league. ________________________________________________________ Dave Trenkel : improv@peak.org : www.peak.org/~improv/ "...there will come a day when you won't have to use gasoline. You'd simply take a cassette and put it in your car, let it run. You'd have to have the proper type of music. Like you take two sticks, put 'em together, make fire. You take some notes and rub 'em together - dum, dum, dum, dum - fire, cosmic fire." -Sun Ra ________________________________________________________ --------------------------------