------------------------------ Loopers-Delight-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 11 Today's Topics: Re: Re: Echoplex functions ? [ Kim Flint ] Re: Re: Echoplex functions ? [ erich kory ] Re: Hello... Hello!...hello!! [ matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias ] Re: freedom, syncing and quantizatio [ matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias ] Re: freedom, syncing and quantizatio [ Kim Flint ] Help! re: Digitech Time Machine 7.6 [ KRosser414 ] ANYONE KNOW THE MIDI PEDAL SCHEME FO [ ENAT21213 ] Re: one-function MIDI pedal? [ PMimlitsch ] Re: one-function MIDI pedal? [ andre ] Re: Help! re: Digitech Time Machine [ "Stephen P. Goodman" ] Re: Help! re: Digitech Time Machine [ andre ] Re: New to looping/processing [ ANET ] Echoplex syncing [ Matthew Blais ] RE: Hello... [ Goddess ] Re: Help! re: Digitech Time Machine [ Kim Flint ] Re: Echoplex syncing [ Kim Flint ] Administrivia: Looper's Delight **************** Please send posts to: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Don't send them to the digest! To subscribe/unsubscribe to the Loopers-Delight digest version, send email with "subscribe" (or "unsubscribe") in both the subject and the body, with no signature files, to: Loopers-Delight-d-request@annihilist.com To subscribe/unsubscribe to the real Loopers-Delight list, send email with "subscribe" (or "unsubscribe") in both the subject and the body, with no signature files, to: Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com Check the web page for archives and lots of other goodies! http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html Your humble list maintainer, Kim Flint kflint@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 12:07:35 -0800 From: Kim Flint To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Re: Echoplex functions ? Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980119200735.00a02190@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:48 PM 1/19/98 EST, Takadimi wrote: >Hey thanks for that info...I can't believe you can only play one loop at a >time-bummer. I'm a drummer/perc. and need to play multiple loops >simultaneously, so, I guess I'll continue my search for a Jam Man. > > Gratefully, > Todd JamMan doesn't do that either, and it's multi-loop functions are somewhat more limited than the echoplex's. The only looper I know of that can sort of do polyphonic/multi-track loops is the Akai Remix16. With that one though, you can't play and record at the same time, and there isn't even any overdubbing. So you have to record all the loops first, and then play them back simultaneously. There is no single device that really does what you want. The echoplex is designed so that you can synchronize multiple units together in various ways, so that one can be used for each track in a multi-track loop. A lot of people do that for the multi-track effect. I think you might be able to do this with multiple JamMan's as well, but it isn't specifically designed for it so it's not so elegant to use. kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 15:23:05 GMT From: erich kory To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Re: Echoplex functions ? Message-Id: <199801191523.PAA02278@phyleus.interlinx.qc.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:48 PM 1/19/98 EST, you wrote: >Hey thanks for that info...I can't believe you can only play one loop at a >time-bummer. I'm a drummer/perc. and need to play multiple loops >simultaneously, so, I guess I'll continue my search for a Jam Man. > > Gratefully, > Todd You can the same as Jamman. In overdub mode. Play one loop, hit the overdub, then play over it. It's all recorded. erich ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 19:05:15 -0300 From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Hello... Hello!...hello!! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I just downloaded two of your samples, Erich. I love Cello, especially when looped, its so monophonic otherwhise :-) ... and you do it well, elaborate and beautifull, almost classical. Welcome Matthias ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 19:05:15 -0300 From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias Grob) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: freedom, syncing and quantization Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" oh, Kim again... I had no idea you did all this (apart form testing :-)... can we hear a result on some CD project or so? Thanks Matthias >At 05:15 PM 1/15/98 -0300, Matthias Grob wrote: > >>Does anyone use the Quantize feature of the Plex? (I understood there is a >>equivalent on the JamMan with a name I do not remember) >>I guess Q level it mainly interesting to work in planned "organized" music, >>where you treat bars and measures. > >I use the quantize function a lot these days. Originally I liked it because >it helped me execute functions more accurately while playing guitar. I don't >play guitar with loops so much these days (or much at all actually), I'm >following some muse into more percussively oriented electronic dance music. >It's organized in the sense that you are often concerned about maintaining a >beat and keeping things aligned according to measure and section, which >means a heavy use of midi clock for syncing. In my case the planned aspect >mostly ends there, as I'm experimenting with taking a more improvised >approach to it rather than sequencing every last millisecond. But I still >want to keep the tempo and beat steady, and not have those things fly out of >my control. > >For this, quantized loop functions are great. It's very easy to record >things played in real time and get a loop sync'd with the sequence and >aligned with the first beat of the pattern. Since I'm also manipulating the >mixer or effects parameters, or triggering drum samples or something, it's >incredibly handy to be able to press the record or multiply or whatever >function when it is convenient, and know that it is going to come in exactly >when it is supposed to. I can finish the function in the same way, by >pressing when it is convenient, and the plex ends the function quantized to >the end of the sequenced patterns. I can then go about manipulating this >loop, effecting it, mixing it in and out, generally terrorizing it, but >keeping it in time the way I want. > >As an example, I have the loopers on aux sends of the mixer, synced to midi >clock from a sequencer. I like to take a loop of the drums and reverse it, >mixing the reverse in and out with the original. First I start the sequence >and then record a loop of its output, which is very convenient because >everything is sync'd and quantized to the first beat of the pattern. I just >hit record any time, and it starts at the right moment. I hit it again when >I've got as much as I want, and it waits to end of the measure to end for >me. Easy! The two are sync'd, aligned, running along next to each other. >Then I hit reverse on the echoplex. The quantizing waits to the end of the >measure before reversing the loop. So now the reversed drums are going, >still sync'd to the original and aligned to the measures. Then I go nuts >with the faders, bringing reversed drum hits in and out, using quick >crossfades between the two, or whatever, creating a new pattern of reverse >and forward drums. > >I might then use multiply to add some real-time playing to the loop, put it >back forwards, and mix between the new loop and the old pattern. Or change >patterns, or whatever. I'll use NextLoop to record several different loops >like this, and it's all quantized and in time with the clock and lined up >with other echoplexes and the sequencer. I can do quantized switches between >all the loops, while mostly concentrating on the mixer, effects, and >playing, and it all stays in time where I want it. There's tons of >possibilities, and I'm only just beginning to explore it with a rather >rudimentary setup. Without quantize I would never be able to execute the >loop functions perfectly enough to keep it all together. With quantize it's >a snap, and I can concentrate on doing other things while the looper does >it's job on it's own. > >As a more advanced technique, I also like to set the echoplexes to time >signatures different from the sequence and each other. Then I capture the >drum pattern from the sequencer in different time signatures, and run it >next to the original. So I might have the original in 4/4 and the loop in >13/8. Running them next to each other gives a constantly shifting rhythm >pattern that can be very interesting. By controlling the mix you can easily >change which one dominates, effectively morphing from one time signature to >another. Quantize is again a life saver here, because I can execute loop >functions without the beat getting out of whack. What's also interesting is >the quantize point changes against the original sequence. It's still in >time, just at a different beat each time through. So you can keep things >evolving. > >so anyway, I'm a quantizing fan! > >now back to the boring work.... > >kim >________________________________________________________ >Kim Flint 408-752-9284 >Mpact System Engineering kflint@chromatic.com >Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 13:05:59 -0800 From: Kim Flint To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: freedom, syncing and quantization Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980119210559.00724c5c@pop.chromatic.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 07:05 PM 1/19/98 -0300, you wrote: >oh, Kim again... I had no idea you did all this (apart form testing :-)... >can we hear a result on some CD project or so? > >Thanks >Matthias > I'm still experimenting with it and still learning about the music and how I relate to it and perform it. (and haven't had enough time for that, due to all the testing.... :-) ) So what I do still sucks hard, basically. When I do something that only sucks a little, I'd be happy to force you all to listen to it.... kim _______________________________________________________ Kim Flint 408-752-9284 Mpact Systems Engineering kflint@chromatic.com Chromatic Research http://www.chromatic.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 17:27:05 EST From: KRosser414 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Help! re: Digitech Time Machine 7.6 Message-ID: Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit So, while waiting for the opportunity to buy an Echoplex or Jamman at a price I can manage, I came up with a Digitech Time Machine 7.6 for $90. This thing appears to be capable of some great stuff, but I need a manual. Anyone have one? I'd gladly pay for a xerox & postage... Thanks, Ken R ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 18:02:24 EST From: ENAT21213 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: ANYONE KNOW THE MIDI PEDAL SCHEME FOR THE ECHOPLEX? Message-ID: <86b291d8.34c3db82@aol.com> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Does any one know what the midi pedal scheme is for the echoplex?My jamman goes somthing like this,1=tap,2 and 3=bypass,4 and 5=replace,6=overdub,7and 8=mute,9,10and11=fade,12=loop#one,13=loop#two,14=loop#three,15=loop#four, 16loop#five,17=loop#six,18=loop#seven,19=loop#eight.Is the echoplex midi pedal scheme anything like this? The pedalboard for the echoplex looks like you have to scroll(tap) to get to a prefered loop?Say I have the nine seperate loops filled,Im on loop# two and I need to get to loop# nine do I have to scroll(tap) up to the ninth loop?I would rather simply press one button per loop to get were I need to be.Im using a ADA MC1 midi pedal. thanks for any help you guys can offer, Brian McKenzie ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 18:11:27 EST From: PMimlitsch To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: one-function MIDI pedal? Message-ID: Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/19/98 1:14:39 PM, you wrote: <> I believe the "Midi Mouse" (Tech 21) does this. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 18:21:50 -0500 (EST) From: andre To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: one-function MIDI pedal? Message-Id: <199801192321.SAA13503@shell.monmouth.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 07:48 PM 1/19/98, you wrote: >Does anyone know if there exists a single pedal which sends a single >specific MIDI message? After thinking about it, the only facility I need >that I can't do with the existing JM pedals is the Short Fade function. Is >it possible to build one (easily)? the Lake Butler midigator, which i have and love - will send out ANY midi signal, and does some HEX stuff i don't need or understand. But it will send anything in the basic protocol, on/off, notes, prog change, ALL OFF, etc. someone had posted a few weeks back on finding a lot fo those cheap/used.... they rule, and they look cool for the gear-gazers (like me) that wander up to the stage after the show.... also - that MIDI MOUSE that tech 21 came up with - small as a dist. box but send prog change only. then there's an obselete Digitech box (in the same chassis as all those digi - 2-pedal boxes... it can be programmed to have a sequence of midi prog changes, that you can stepp thru at will. perhaps, though, none of this blather has helped you ! andre' ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 15:22:15 -0800 From: "Stephen P. Goodman" To: Subject: Re: Help! re: Digitech Time Machine 7.6 Message-ID: <000601bd2531$16020be0$f122dacf@sgoodman> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit KRosser414 asked: >So, while waiting for the opportunity to buy an Echoplex or Jamman at a price >I can manage, I came up with a Digitech Time Machine 7.6 for $90. This thing >appears to be capable of some great stuff, but I need a manual. Anyone have >one? I'd gladly pay for a xerox & postage... I've got their number at home, which I called when I got MINE - and got the manual FREE. Good company! Stephen. Stephen Goodman * http://www.earthlight.net/Studios EarthLight Productions * Get the Loop Of The Week Free! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 12:28:12 -0800 From: Sean Echevarria To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Re: Echoplex functions ? Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980119122812.00a664c0@global.california.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Wasn't the upgrade that Bob was planning (before Lex axed it) going to allow simultaneous playback of multiple loops? At 12:07 PM 1/19/98 -0800, Kim wrote: >JamMan doesn't do that either, and it's multi-loop functions are somewhat >more limited than the echoplex's. The only looper I know of that can sort of >do polyphonic/multi-track loops is the Akai Remix16. With that one though, >you can't play and record at the same time, and there isn't even any >overdubbing. So you have to record all the loops first, and then play them >back simultaneously. There is no single device that really does what you >want. The echoplex is designed so that you can synchronize multiple units >together in various ways, so that one can be used for each track in a >multi-track loop. A lot of people do that for the multi-track effect. I >think you might be able to do this with multiple JamMan's as well, but it >isn't specifically designed for it so it's not so elegant to use. > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 19:10:56 GMT From: erich kory To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Hello... Hello!...hello!! Message-Id: <199801191910.TAA16488@phyleus.interlinx.qc.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 07:05 PM 1/19/98 -0300, you wrote: >I just downloaded two of your samples, Erich. >I love Cello, especially when looped, its so monophonic otherwhise :-) >... and you do it well, elaborate and beautifull, almost classical. > >Welcome >Matthias > >Thanx, I did spend 20 years of my life in Classical Music, iguess it has to come out somewhere! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 18:38:18 -0500 (EST) From: andre To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Help! re: Digitech Time Machine 7.6 Message-Id: <199801192338.SAA21334@shell.monmouth.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 05:27 PM 1/19/98 EST, you wrote: >So, while waiting for the opportunity to buy an Echoplex or Jamman at a price >I can manage, I came up with a Digitech Time Machine 7.6 for $90. This thing >appears to be capable of some great stuff, but I need a manual. Anyone have >one? I'd gladly pay for a xerox & postage... hey ken... i have, and of course adore, my 7.6, in fact i just found a 8sec TM... i gotta say though, i don't have a manual, but you might not need it - it's all pretty basic... a good addition is a pair of boss FS-5L - very tough built pedals for on/off and hold function. but, hands-on works great too! also - an expression pedal can give you a cool/cheezy pitch/or time shift sound.. any specific questions - gimme an e-mail -i'll gladly help > peace, andre' ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 21:27:35 EST From: ANET To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: New to looping/processing Message-ID: <3316a72.34c40b9a@aol.com> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 98-01-19 10:31:31 EST, you write: > Hi, > I'm an acoustic guitarist/singer/composer and I'm getting interested in the > concept of looping and processing the acoustic guitar. I'm intrigued with > the idea of extending my solo guitar and voice concept to incorporate new > sounds, textures, and rhythms via electronics. > I too am an acoustic guitarist who is actively using a JAMMAN for live performances. I added the memory upgrade of which I now have 32 seconds of delay time. When audiences hear the loops, they are very surprised due to the fact that the tones are very serene as well as somewhat hypnotic. My guitar is handmade of which I use Martin Thinline Pick-ups, the guitar is Koa back and sides with a Cedar top. I run into a CRATE 125D acoustic guitar amp which gives phenominal sound reproduction. >From that, I run the line level output to the Jam man input, the jamman to the Mackie board and then on to output eq and an Alesis Stereo compressor. The guitar and pickup provide a very bright sound which is then mixed with Crate's digital delays (about 16 choices in all, all sound very nice). I remove most of the mids to avoid a tunnel sound and then run the entire mix through a switiching amp to Community speakers. Altogehter, a very nice set up. I do have some noise from the Crate but am able to filter it on the output eq. I am set up for full stereo operation and had toyed with the idea of running the dry mix to the left and the jamman to the right, but didn't care for the sound too much. I have an RDS8000 which could give me a cheap-man's stereo (additional delay to one side) but have not had the chance to try it out yet. As far as pickups, each to his own. In the high-end acoustic guitar circles, there seems to be quite the argument over the mic sound vs. piezeos. I prefer a piezeo. The system placed into the Alvarez Yari is quite nice. I don't care for BAGGS pickups or any system mounted (god-forbid) across the sound hole. Good luck to you, as soon as you get your echoplex, you'll be doing solo gigs. Adios. Oh by the way, I am producing the 3rd cd project. Are you interested? John Peters ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 21:59:29 -0500 From: Matthew Blais To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Echoplex syncing Message-ID: <01BD2525.8B804960.mblais@ma.ultranet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, My name is Matthew, I'm new to this list. I have two V5.0 Echoplexes which I have been trying (in vain) to get to operate synced in stereo with BrotherSync. has anybody out there been successful at this, or does it just NOT WORK? Anyone else tried this? Thanks, -- Matthew Blais ____________________________________________________ "Healing and Spiritual Crisis" WWW site: http://www.spiritweb.org/Spirit/blais.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 00:24:19 EST From: Marzzz To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: one-function MIDI pedal? Message-ID: <7307c51a.34c43505@aol.com> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/19/98 12:16:18 PM, pycraft@elec.gla.ac.uk wrote: >Does anyone know if there exists a single pedal which sends a single >specific MIDI message? You can put a volume pedal (such as an Ernie Ball) thru an Anatek Pocket Pedal Midi convertor. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Oct 1997 21:57:55 -0600 From: Goddess To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: RE: Hello... Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19971019215755.007a0bb0@pop3.concentric.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi Laurie, It's nice to find other women doing this sort of thing! Thanks for the reply! What instrument(s) to you play? I'd like to hear some of what you do... I'll be talking again soon, but as of now, it's late here so I'm going to sign off. smiles, Corynne At 12:10 AM 1/19/98 -0800, you wrote: > >From Corynne: >>Hello, I've just joined the looper's delight list earlier this week...[snip] > >Welcome abroad! (oops... aboard) . I just signed on a few months ago, myself. > >>I'm currently looking to get an Oberheim Echo-plex digital pro. > >It's like having a beige '56 Jag XK-120 with a warp drive retrofit docked right >there in your rack. Sweeeeet. > >>P.S. Are there any other women on this list? > >Yup. ;^)=8=<== > >laurie > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 23:15:47 -0800 From: Kim Flint To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Help! re: Digitech Time Machine 7.6 Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 3:22 PM -0800 1/19/98, Stephen P. Goodman wrote: >KRosser414 asked: >>appears to be capable of some great stuff, but I need a manual. Anyone >>have one? I'd gladly pay for a xerox & postage... > > >I've got their number at home, which I called when I got MINE - and got the >manual FREE. hey, if someone wants to scan the manual, I'd be happy to put it on the website. Also, lots of great info has been posted about this box. It would be great if someone could complile it all into a FAQ for the Time Machine page. That poor lonely page sure could use someone to take care of it! Just think of the fame and self promotion it would gain you... Looper's Delight gets over 3000 hits a week. All those people looking at YOUR handywork....imagine: the job offers come streaming in....overflowing bank accounts....new home studio toys....parties with rock stars and super models....it could all be yours, just for one measly web page..... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 02:48:33 -0800 From: Kim Flint To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Echoplex syncing Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 9:59 PM -0500 1/19/98, Matthew Blais wrote: >Hi, > >My name is Matthew, I'm new to this list. > >I have two V5.0 Echoplexes which I have been trying (in vain) to get to >operate synced in stereo with BrotherSync. has anybody out there been >successful at this, or does it just NOT WORK? Anyone else tried this? well, I'm quite certain it works, since I spent about a year testing it! If there's anything wrong after that, it's the beta tester's fault...:-) You probably have something wrong in your set up. First of all, with LoopIII v5.0 the default parameters are set for stereo. So start off by resetting the parameters on both units. You do this by turning the power on with the Parameter button held down. Keep it held until the start up screen finishes and you get to the reset screen. Now all your parameters should be set right for stereo. Next, decide which unit is the master. This is the one where you will execute all the controls. The slave will just follow it. Connect a Midi cable from the Midi Out of the master unit to the Midi in of the slave. At this point you should be able to execute functions on the master and see that the slave follows. The BrotherSync connection ensures that the stereo units maintain very tight synchronization between each other, actually locking the sample clocks together. Make sure you have the right sort of cable. It should be a 1/4" tip-ring-sleeve (TRS) cable. A mono cable will NOT work. Connect the BrotherSync's of the two units together with this cable. That should be it. The master should control the slave, and you should have stereo loops. Let me know if you have any other questions. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com --------------------------------