From: "Louis Collier Hyams" Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 10:19:35 -0400 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Plex Pricing matthias and olivier. tupkal is the achronym we as a group have more or less given to the unseen echoplex systems upgrade. the second bit was about wise financial choices and when to purchase the echoplex. ie... what I meant was, (from my experiences dealing with most manufacturers) that I will wait until oberheim/gibson gets the plex to a state that I personally deem acceptable in order to avoid getting letdown(shit on, the shaft, diddled, stepped on) by the company. those are more expressions for you to work on. being a student again means I have to be very careful with money(deutsche mark, franck, yen, baht, pound, lire, dollar). sorry for the confusion collier I've been toying with the idea of setting up a mac IIci with hyperprism to do looping and midi controlled spacial effects. I might put a samplecell card in it also. anyone done this? Date: Sun, 29 Sep 96 13:27:21 CST From: "Todd Madson" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com, ToddM@lasermaster.com Subject: Re: superimposing pitchshifter.. Re: Olivier's "Organ Synthesis": > An other thing. once I ried something that i now will call "organ synthesis". > Duh? > By using two diferent pitchshifter, on set an octave above, with > regeneration, and the other one octave lower than your signa, and with a > bit of regeneration too. > You route them in way that they are serial (is it english?) well, anyway, > one goes into another. play then guitarn Stick, whatever you want, and you > get an hammond sound (wel, do not exagerate too much olivier, will you?) > Ok, an organ sound. Your shifter(s) are like drawbars and the basic tone > voice of the thing is your instrument. Olivier: I did this on a track called "Ghosts" with two ART SGE's, and two Digitech GSP5's at one point about three years ago and got a similar result. Check out http://www.waste.org/~crash/index.html and click the crash icon - you can download a sample of what it sounded like. > Nice effect, powerfull sound, and a bit strange like something you know, > but it is not exactly what it used to be.... Right. It maintains the guitaristic elements of your instrument, but sounds a bit...odd. Glad to see someone else stumbled across this too. Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 12:29:19 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) Subject: Re: Hello... >>Ken R said: >>>Hi - >>> >>>I'm brand new here and thought I would start off by asking two questions: >>> >>>1) Is there an archive of old messages? [kim said:] >>I am planning to do this, but haven't quite managed yet. There will be a >>section on the Looper's Delight web site with batches of past postings. You >>haven't missed a whole lot, really. Although we have been quite prolific, >>the list has only been alive for three weeks now. I'll let you know when >>post archives go up. >> [Matthias said:] >OH NO, I think you missed a lot, Ken. There have been very nice hints and >storys. > >I was thinking of maybe do the work to collect those. An archive of all >mails might be about useless after some time, because the subject usually >does not point directly to the content (look at this very message!) and >even less to quality. I think the thing we need is some sort of FAQ. We could condense the interesting discussions into key points and put them in neat categories. As more interesting discussions occur we can add those. At the same time, I'd still like to an archive of all the messages.There's no reason we can't have both. Doing the archive won't be too hard really. Especially after I get the digest version going, because then the server will be automatically combining messages into a single file on a regular basis. All I would have to do is put it in the proper directory for the web page and put a link to it somewhere. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 16:10:18 -0400 From: KRosser414@aol.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Hello... In a message dated 96-09-29 15:31:55 EDT, you write: >>OH NO, I think you missed a lot, Ken. There have been very nice hints and >>storys. >> As a Vortex owner, I would be eternally grateful to anyone who could forward me some of the talk about that magnificent beast... Ken Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 14:28:29 -0700 (PDT) From: The Man Himself To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: PERSONAL PROFILES: A couple of other points Hello again loopists: A couple of other things I'd like to ask before you start sending me your profiles tomorrow. First of all, in order to make this as hassle-free as possible, I'd appreciate it if you could enter the information directly into the profile form, make sure that it's correctly formatted (i.e. no wierd line breaks or other bits of oddness) and then send it back to me. This will make the process a great deal easier. Secondly, you should hold on to a copy of your own form in case something happens on this end. Mind you, I don't expect anything do go wrong, but it's better to cover all bases. Thanks for following the guidelines; you can start sending me the profiles tomorrow. And in case anybody's tuning in late or doesn't know what I'm talking about, I'm attatching another copy of the form below. Loop on, --Andre ------- *LOOPERS DELIGHT PROFILE FORM* (Fill in the information below and return it to altruist@shoko.calarts.edu for inclusion on the Looper's Delight Web Site.) NAME AGE ADDRESS PHONE E-MAIL URL PRIMARY LOOPING GEAR (or methodology for non-electronic loopists) INFLUENCES MUSICAL STYLE OR MAIN AREAS OF CONCENTRATION ENSEMBLES AVAILABLE RECORDINGS CONTACT INFORMATION (if different from above) PERSONAL STATEMENT (something reasonably informative yet concise would be cool -- probably two to three paragraphs maximum). Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 15:39:36 -0700 (PDT) From: The Man Himself To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: One more setail about personal bleebs for the web One other thing, folks -- I'll assume that unless you mention other wise, any URL's listed in your profiles will automatically be linked when they're eventually uploaded by Kim. So if for some reason you don't want links on your URLs, let us know now! Best, --Andre Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 17:14:30 -0700 (PDT) From: The Man Himself To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: Yet another category Matt McCabe has suggested a "primary instrument" category be added to the profiles; sounds good to me. I leave it to ye to include it in the forms. Loop on (and on and on and on...) --Andre Date: 29 Sep 96 23:59:20 EDT From: Teed Rockwell <74164.3703@CompuServe.COM> To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Re: Amplification of course, all of this talk about how inconvenient and unpredictable and noisy guitar amps are is absolutely true, and I fought using a guitar amp for years for just that reason. Unfortunately, for my sound at least, none of those tube preamps, or Sansamp amp emulators can come even remotely close to duplicating the sound of a good all tube guitar preamp. Its easy to talk yourself into believing that it does, when you think of all the trouble the guitar amp causes, but in my case, I'm certain that they don't come even close. Teed Rockwell Date: 29 Sep 96 23:59:14 EDT From: Teed Rockwell <74164.3703@CompuServe.COM> To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Re: simple loop idea 2 Clark writes: Back when i had a 2 sec looper my favorite thing to do was to build impossibly fast chordal passages with guitar loops. I would input one chord at a time (sometimes one note at a time) and stagger them so that they were very close together. I discovered this technique by acccident by playing a 3 over 4 cross rhythm. When you get to the second time around, all of the beats in the 3 pattern are now 1/2 beat away from the first time you played them, and you get this exact rapid fire effect. Teed Rockwell 74164.3703@compuserve.com Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 21:42:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Looping Setup > >Now for the adventurous, I encourage you to explore beyond the cheesy >faders and footpedals. Check out the Buchla Thunder and Buchla Lightning. >These instruments are designed and built by the enigmatic Don Buchla, who >is considered to be the co-father of synthesizers as musical instruments, >along with Bob Moog. Don is brilliant, and quite possibly one of the most >visionary people to ever enter the craft of musical instrument design. >Naturally the industry ignores him and no one buys any of his stuff. >Doesn't help that he's more than a little unusual and difficult to work >with, but share a bottle of wine (or 3 or 4, probably) with him and you >won't regret it. Anyway, unlike Moog, who builds theremins somewhere in New >York, Don is still creating the future. Distant future probably! I didn't know that Buchla was still at it! I've wanted one of his modular analogue synths since before I bought my (brand new) Pro-1 (i.e., a long time ago). Thanks for the pointer! BTW, Bob spent quite a few years at Big Briar trying to sell 4-d synth controllers and stuff, before he gave up and turned to the Theremin business. Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 21:45:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Looping Setup BTW, there's no info on Thunder or Rain & Wind on Buchla's web pages. And the Thunder is $2k! Yow. For that price, etc. Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 22:36:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Unidentified subject! >Their SoundEdit does it for cheap, and they say it sounds much better than >RealAudio... Could it be worth the investment of the like 300 bucks (less, >if bought together with DECK), since we are going to offer a lot of sound >samples, I hope :) ? No matter how much dough I might have, $300 for a file type conversion is not cheap. If they build it into the next version of Deck, I may just spring for the upgrade. . . Date: Sun, 29 Sep 1996 22:56:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: A life of its own (was Re: Vortex Loops Using Deja Vu B) Kim Flint writes: >One time I looped a little sound made by scratching the sixth string of a >Les Paul with my fingernail, then letting it ring a bit. I reversed it, and >suddenly it was a completely beautiful, mesmerizing noise. Hard to describe >it. Sort of a cross between the om sound for meditating and a digeridoo. That's funny: the last few nights playing with the Vortext, I've spent quite a lot of time looping sounds made by scratching the strings with my fingernail, a very stiff pick, a screwdriver, muting the strings and banging on them with a screwdriver, banging on the strings above the nut, etc. On another loopers' tool, I've been having mixed results with my new ebow. It sometimes takes quite a while for the string to start to ring, especially when I'm trying to bring out a harmonic that isn't the octave. Any tips? Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 01:36:41 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) Subject: Re: A life of its own (was Re: Vortex Loops Using Deja Vu B) Ray wrote: >On another loopers' tool, I've been having mixed results with my new >ebow. It sometimes takes quite a while for the string to start to >ring, especially when I'm trying to bring out a harmonic that isn't >the octave. Any tips? In addition to the e-bow, I use a Fernandes Sustainer guitar for this sort of thing. It has a switch that lets you put the sustainer circuit in three different modes. One generally sustains the fundamental, another the second harmonic, and the third some higher harmonic. The third mode is really cool, because it basically makes the guitar sound as if you were getting a massive feedback sound, without the ear destroying volume. It also has a level control that basically sets how quickly the note begins sustaining. It is quite a bit faster than the ebow, but I find the two are not quite the same and still use both. Also, using the Fernandes sustainer usually means you are stuck with the Fernandes guitar. I got the cheap-o one, and I don't really care for it much for anything other than the sustain sounds. You can get these installed in other guitars, but it is quite difficult. You have to find a tech that knows how to do it, and it will be expensive. I think Gary Brawer in San Francisco does this; I know someone that had these things installed in some PRS guitars and I think Gary did the work. Anyway, I really like using this with loops. One of my favorite things is to overdub many layers of one "feedback" tone, making a huge sound. Often times I'll use the whammy bar at the same point in the loop on each pass through, usually pulling it in different directions and different amounts. So the loop will go along with some big, consonant sound and then slowly go completely psychotic. Another thing is to make big sustained chords by sliding to a different note on each overdub pass. Since I have such a strong aversion to anything consonant, this usually means stacked half-step intervals, tritones, +5's, major 7's, and such. Actually, even that doesn't sound out anymore, so it often means bending in quarter tones for more microtonal chords. Your mileage may vary.... kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From: "Louis Collier Hyams" Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 13:01:44 -0400 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: A life of its own (was Re: Vortex Loops Using Deja Vu B) ray, have you used ebow in the past? many people try to use mine (1 early 80's and one aluminum) give up. once the principal is understood they can usually get it. some try to push to hard or otherwise unoptimize string to magnetic field variables. (even though those techniques work great when done intentionally. check the batteries(of course) some people prefer partially discharged batteries for their response check placement of ebow over pickups spend a lot of time without the guitar plugged into the amp. ie acoustically all the technique and tone should begin this way. ok, that's my few cents From: "Louis Collier Hyams" Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 13:05:29 -0400 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: sustainor kim! whatup... so, about these fernades sustainors... who what when and where can I get the parts from? Fernandes isn't entirely helpful, do you have a contact there? Dealers seem to be useless. I'll be perusing pawn shops in NYC collier Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 12:17:52 -0500 (CDT) From: Dave Stagner To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: New/old toys! I went to a guitar show in eastern Iowa yesterday and horse-traded a couple of *great* pieces. :} First, I traded my old Boss Pitch Shifter/Delay (my first awful looping device), a fuzz box, and $15 for an ADA expression pedal, an ADA quad footswitch, and... a DeltaLabs Echotron. The Echotron is just *gorgeous*. It's an early-80s long (250ms-4096ms) delay line, with infinite repeat capability. Monophonic (of course), LED tempo flashers on the front panel, sync clock output, and a beautiful tone. No CPU or VLSI anywhere inside... it looks like everything is in TTL logic. The sound quality, while not as "pure" as the CD-quality boxes we see these days, has a funky, analogish richness that doesn't mangle the guitar's dynamics the way the new boxes do (funny how "dynamic range" is such a complete crock when real music is involved). It even overdrives well, lots better than my JamMan! And of course, the delay time knob smoothly manipulates the pitch of echoes already in the machine, a technique I've much missed with the Lexicon tap-delay stuff. Does anyone remember (or better yet, own) one of these gems? Happy though I am, I do have a couple of questions. First, I'll gladly pay for a copy or photocopy of the original manual, and schematics if they're available. Second, does anyone know how the "feedback" jack in the back works? I'm assuming it's for an expression pedal to control the feedback rate, but I don't know what expression pedal type is needed (and I've already rewired the new ADA pedal for my Vortex). And if it doesn't want an expression pedal, what does it do? Sadly, the feedback jack is broken. It'll work, but it won't keep the plug stable. I need to find the same model somewhere and drop a new one on the PC board. I'm leery about taking the soldering iron to this baby unless absolutely necessary, for obvious reasons. I have the ADA expression pedal working now, but not fully satisfactory. It looks to me like the Vortex uses the pot as a voltage divider. The ADA, unfortunately, does not use the full sweep range of the pot. Depending on how I put it together, I can get a 1-56 range, or an 8-64 range. I'm going to try and hack it with a smaller extra pot to "tune" the sweep range. I hope it works. The Quad footswitch needs some work, too. It has four momentary switches in a single box, and I'm hoping to use it to run at least two switches for the JamMan/Vortex. But when I kludged it together last night, one of the switches was permanently on. I don't want to destroy the original functionality of the box, so I don't know about getting it to work yet. Another useful toy I picked up at the show is a high-quality acoustic guitar pickup system. I traded my old Frankenstein monster Strat for it (it's sad when dealers will give $150 for the neck, but won't give $300 for the whole guitar). It's a top-of-the-line Fishman transducer/microphone system with a really nice preamp. So pretty soon my wife's $100 Yamaha flat-top that I love so much will have a $600 pickup system. :P This is really nice for me. I am primarily an acoustic guitarist, and not very comfortable on electric. Now I will be able to feed a clean, high-quality acoustic signal into my looping devices. :} Moreover, the preamp system can either mix or split the transducer and microphone signals, so I can run things into separate effects chains if I feel like doing something elaborate. I'm REALLY looking forward to this. I finally have a good expression pedal for the Vortex, and a way of getting my best playing into my loopers. I have a warm-sounding looper to put in FRONT of the Vortex, and someone is even loaning me an old Tascam Portastudio! Life is good. :} -dave By "beauty," I mean that which seems complete. Obversely, that the incomplete, or the mutilated, is the ugly. Venus De Milo. To a child she is ugly. /* dstagner@icarus.leepfrog.com */ -Charles Fort /* http://www.leepfrog.com/~dstagner */ Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 10:22:51 -0700 (PDT) From: The Man Himself To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: E-bow tips > On another loopers' tool, I've been having mixed results with my new > ebow. It sometimes takes quite a while for the string to start to > ring, especially when I'm trying to bring out a harmonic that isn't > the octave. Any tips? Try pressing the bow closer to the string -- in other words, if there's a "default" spot where the bow is resting along the two guide grooves, then pressing down further so that the bow is in greater proximity to the string will help sound the string faster. Also be very aware of where you're placing the bow in relation to whatever pickup you're using; the closer the bow is to the currently selected pickup, the more signal you're going to produce. Additionally, lightly fretting the note in question with the left hand will help start the sound (not much help when talking about natural string harmonics, I know). Also be sure and listen to the tape that comes with the bow. I put off listening to it myself for almost six months after I got it, and when I finally got around to it I was stunned at some of the sounds that can come out of the thing. Like the slogan says, "Infinite sustain is only the beginning." (Now where's my endorsement deal?) Good luck, --Andre Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 17:07:13 -0700 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: studio seventeen productions Subject: Re: E-bow tips At 10:22 AM 9/30/96 -0700, you wrote: >> On another loopers' tool, I've been having mixed results with my new >> ebow. It sometimes takes quite a while for the string to start to >> ring, especially when I'm trying to bring out a harmonic that isn't >> the octave. Any tips? > >Try pressing the bow closer to the string -- in other words, if there's a >"default" spot where the bow is resting along the two guide grooves, then >pressing down further so that the bow is in greater proximity to the >string will help sound the string faster. Also be very aware of where >you're placing the bow in relation to whatever pickup you're using; the >closer the bow is to the currently selected pickup, the more signal >you're going to produce. Additionally, lightly fretting the note in >question with the left hand will help start the sound (not much help when >talking about natural string harmonics, I know). > >Also be sure and listen to the tape that comes with the bow. I put off >listening to it myself for almost six months after I got it, and when I >finally got around to it I was stunned at some of the sounds that can >come out of the thing. Like the slogan says, "Infinite sustain is >only the beginning." (Now where's my endorsement deal?) > >Good luck, > >--Andre > > Since EBOW has been my specialty fo about 15 years... I might add to all this: try using the EBOW backwards. (FACING THE TREBLE PICKUP). Once I saw Bill Nelson doing this I adopted it and never looked back (about 10 years ago???). I very RARELY direct it towards the bass pickup anymore....the treble is great, much better attack, much brighter...but the best trick of all: turn the tone control for the treble pickup to OFF (full bass) and then EBOW against the treble pickup. eiree and cool. enjoy! dave at studio seventeen 173451681734516817345168173451681734516817345168 * * * * * * i'll be downstairs if you need me. * * i'll still be downstairs if you DON'T need me * * (Mr. Blint, Consequences/Godley & Creme) * * * * visit: http:www.adnc.com/web/ambient/index.html seventeen: the ambient music page 173451681734516817345168173451681734516817345168 From: George Henry To: "'Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com'" Subject: Personal Profile Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 19:59:43 -0400 Name: George Henry Age: 42 Address: 12870 East Daybreak Court Jacksonville, FL 32246 Phone: (904)221-6438 E-Mail: windharp@fcol.com URL: None presently; will announce when I get one. Primary Looping Gear: I use a Roland VG-8, which provides a maximum delay of 1023 ms; and a crude audio editor that came bundled with a sound card. I would like to acquire PC-based audio software, and possibly a dedicated looping instrument as well. Influences: Too numerous, eclectic, and wide-ranging to list (seriously). Musical Style / Concentration: I am working toward an integration of freely flowing improvisation with discretely composed (i.e. sequenced) musical parts. Two different parts of my brain know how to make music in their own separate ways. I'm hoping for interesting results when I get them working well together. If I wanted to find my music in a store, I'd probably look in the "ambient" category. Ensembles: Cirrus Susurrus Personnel / primary instruments: George Henry - Chapman Stick and Roland VG-8 Cynthia Henry - Zendrum Available Recordings: None; working on a demo. Personal Statement: I've been interested in looping since hearing "Frippertronics" and some Steve Reich pieces a few years back. Cindy and I have been avid music fans since childhood. I've played guitar since I was 14, and Cindy used to play the flute. We have lately adopted the notion that we would like to create and publicize our own musical expressions. A rough translation from Latin of "Cirrus Susurrus" is "Whispering Wisps" ... not intended to give the false impression that our music is always subtle and unobtrusive. Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 18:15:51 -0700 (PDT) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: finley@ecst.csuchico.edu (Matthew F. McCabe) Subject: JamMan page Greetings all! I'm putting together a JamMan page for the web page. If you have any tips/ideas please drop me a line. Thanks! Matt ------------------------------------------------------------ King Never http://www.ecst.csuchico.edu/~finley/kingnever.html ------------------------------------------------------------ Matthew F. McCabe Able Cain King Never Marathon Records Date: Mon, 30 Sep 1996 21:57:01 -0400 From: RA336@aol.com To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: hyperprism >I've been toying with the idea of setting up a mac IIci with >hyperprism to do >looping and midi controlled spacial effects. I might put a >samplecell card in >it also. anyone done this? - Torn has. The results (in his hands, anyway) are all over his latest; "What Means Solid, Traveler?" we also used this technique a bit on my record... it's fun and the results can be utterly unworldly. have fun! Robby Aceto Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 00:00:16 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) Subject: Re: sustainor >so, about these fernades sustainors... who what when and where can I get the >parts from? Fernandes isn't entirely helpful, do you have a contact there? >Dealers seem to be useless. > >I'll be perusing pawn shops in NYC > >collier I'm not sure about the parts. I've heard that you have to get it special ordered from Japan, and it costs $400 in the US. I've met the Artists Relations Director from Fernandes, he might be able to help although he's probably not the right guy. His name is Scott Uchida, phone = 818-988-6790. >From what I've heard, once you've bought the parts and had it installed, you've probably spent more than it would have cost to buy one of their guitars with it built in. And since the tolerences have to be fairly exact for it to work right, you have to find a tech that knows how to do it properly. I bought the guitar at a sale at Bananas at Large. Cost $300 and worth it, I think. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 00:04:55 -0800 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: kflint@annihilist.com (Kim Flint) Subject: Re: New/old toys! Dave said: >I went to a guitar show in eastern Iowa yesterday and horse-traded a >couple of *great* pieces. :} First, I traded my old Boss Pitch >Shifter/Delay (my first awful looping device), a fuzz box, and $15 for >an ADA expression pedal, an ADA quad footswitch, and... a DeltaLabs >Echotron. I've seen these in Black Market music in SF, but never tried it. Seems to me a friend of mine actually knew something about it. If I remember who it was, I'll ask him.... >The Echotron is just *gorgeous*. It's an early-80s long >(250ms-4096ms) delay line, with infinite repeat capability. >Monophonic (of course), LED tempo flashers on the front panel, sync >clock output, and a beautiful tone. No CPU or VLSI anywhere >inside... it looks like everything is in TTL logic. The sound >quality, while not as "pure" as the CD-quality boxes we see these >days, has a funky, analogish richness that doesn't mangle the guitar's >dynamics the way the new boxes do (funny how "dynamic range" is such a >complete crock when real music is involved). It even overdrives well, >lots better than my JamMan! And of course, the delay time knob >smoothly manipulates the pitch of echoes already in the machine, a >technique I've much missed with the Lexicon tap-delay stuff. Sounds like a score! Mind if I lift your text and use it for a little blurb on the web page? Some day we may manage to get a fairly complete history of all these funky toys.... If you find any more info on it, let me know and I'll put that up there too. kim ______________________________________________________________________ Kim Flint | Looper's Delight kflint@annihilist.com | http://www.annihilist.com/loop/loop.html http://www.annihilist.com/ | Loopers-Delight-request@annihilist.com From: "Steven R. Murrell" To: "'Loop'" Subject: Address for Bios Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 09:02:43 -0400 Help! I misplaced the address to which we were to send our short biographical forms. Could someone please post this address one more time? Thanks, Steve Murrell smurrell@ford.com Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 07:10:10 -0400 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: Chris Chovit Subject: Re: hyperprism >>I've been toying with the idea of setting up a mac IIci with >hyperprism to >do >>looping and midi controlled spacial effects. I might put a >samplecell card >in >>it also. anyone done this? I haven't...I'm fascinated though....what is hyperprism? And what midi controlled spatial effects do you use? I don't suppose they are reasonably priced...... - chris --------------------------------------- Chris Chovit cho@gomez.jpl.nasa.gov --------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 09:21:53 -0500 (CDT) From: Dave Stagner To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: New/old toys! When I find out more, and gather some experience with it, I'll do a nice writeup for you, Kim. In the meantime, feel free to put my comments on the web page. :} If any of you run across another one of these babies and don't want it, let me know. But I suspect that if you do find one, you'll be snapping it up yourself. That's what *I'd* do! It does two things the JamMan doesn't do that I've really missed. First, it lets you use it as a regular delay, with regular feedback control, and turn on infinite repeat when you like what you have. Second, you can vary the pitch of the content of the delay with the delay time knob. Hee! I used to own a Digitech Two Second Delay, and the controls are similar. The big difference is that the Echotron's sound doesn't suck all the life out of my tone. Yay! -dave By "beauty," I mean that which seems complete. Obversely, that the incomplete, or the mutilated, is the ugly. Venus De Milo. To a child she is ugly. /* dstagner@icarus.leepfrog.com */ -Charles Fort /* http://www.leepfrog.com/~dstagner */ From: "Louis Collier Hyams" Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 13:58:35 -0400 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: hyperprism chris, (and thanks RA) hyperprism is put out by arboretum systems. it's relatively expensive. it's generally mac platform for sound tools, audiomedia, protools tdm, stand alone or with tdm, and now for powerpc standalone. uh, well,,, it's something you would have to get into. there are stereo-morestereo-hyperstereo effects along with phase-flange-chorus-doppler-pitch-time-delay and etc.... arboretum has a web page, I'll look it up collier Subject: Re: hyperprism Date: Tue, 1 Oct 96 12:15:43 -0000 From: Tom Attix* To: >arboretum has a web page, I'll look it up http://www.arboretum.com/index.html -Tom Attix _______________________________________________ attix@apple.com _______________________________________________ "Some mornings, it's just not worth chewing through the leather straps". - Emo Phillips Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 12:18:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Plex Pricing Clark Battle writes: > >I just got off the phone with Nadine's and the $500 >price is confirmed. They dont have any in stock though. I am interested in a group discount. Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 12:37:20 -0700 (PDT) From: The Man Himself To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Address for Bios On Tue, 1 Oct 1996, Steven R. Murrell wrote: > Help! I misplaced the address to which we were to send our short > biographical forms. Could someone please post this address one more time? Send it to me. (altruist@music.calarts.edu) BTW, many people have already responded; quite a wide range of loopists. There are still a few conspicuous absences (paging Misters Flint, Durant, and Aceto...) so get them in when you can! --Andre Date: Tue, 01 Oct 96 17:25:32 CST From: "Todd Madson" To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: sustainor I read in a Hamer Guitars catalog that one of their strat shaped metal sort of guitars has a sustainor built in. That would probably be a better instrument than some of the lower end guitars that has this feature built in. Todd Madson. Date: Tue, 1 Oct 1996 17:04:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Plex Pricing "Louis Collier Hyams" writes: >matthias and olivier. >tupkal is the achronym we as a group have more or less given to the unseen >echoplex systems upgrade. the second bit was about wise financial choices and >when to purchase the echoplex. ie... I think they were wondering about the "shoot my wad" idiom that you so skillfully employed. ;-) Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 00:23:31 -0300 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias) Subject: Re: Amplification Teed Rockwell wrote >... Its easy to talk yourself into >believing that it does, when you think of all the trouble the guitar amp >causes, >but in my case, I'm certain that they don't come even close. If you have an ideal, the copy never comes close enough. If you talk yourself into wanting to find out the ways of expression in a cheap, handy, versatile gear, you may find that there are more than you had, allthough all different. It means relearning the instrument, maybe? Or even disconnect from the sound tradition (of the 60ies)? For me it happened when a high end speaker builder (Peter Gregor) listened to all my problems of imitating "bad" speakers and finally said: "why dont you just play your instrument with the truest signal that you can get out of it?" So I started to play piezo pickup pure into linear system and found the way to play it softly and liking it and later I started to modify the sound with what pleased. Well, Peter also told me that "bad" speakers produce low harmonics and that the guitar players might like this aditional low bass. So I built the POLYSUBBASS, a 3 string octave divider with "priority". Unfortunately, it only works with polyphonic instruments. But there are ways to create the effect from mono, too. I may be wrong Matthias Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 01:50:00 -0500 (CDT) To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: lfs@Onramp.NET (Larry Spence) Subject: Re: New/old toys! >>The Echotron is just *gorgeous*. It's an early-80s long >>(250ms-4096ms) delay line, with infinite repeat capability. There's a Craig Anderton book titled _The Digital Delay Handbook_ (Amsco, 1985) that has a whole chapter entitled "Echotron Applications" where he suggests uses for the sync output, etc. He also mentions that Echotrons overdrive in a useful way. But don't assume that all Deltalab delays are this way -- the Deltalab Timeline (DL-4) delay sounds like it's just wrapping zero when it goes over 0 dB. While the DL-4 only goes up to 512 ms delay, it has send/return jacks in the eq'd feedback path, so you can patch in your Echotron there and get _really_ carried away... There's a connector on the back of the DL-4 labeled "MEMORY" -- anyone have any idea how to hook it up to some extra RAM? I seem to remember reading somewhere that Deltalab delays used some weird serial bitstream delta encoding for the digitized signal (e.g. the DL-4 has two rows of LEDs, one for "peak headroom," the other for "slew headroom"). BTW, can anyone tell me what the difference between the Yamaha E1005 and E1010 analog delays is? I have an E1005, but occasionally see ads for used E1010s. Does it just have a longer delay time, or are there extra features? Thanks, Larry Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 10:16:25 -0700 (PDT) From: The Man Himself To: loopers-delight@annihilist.com Subject: BIOS: Update 'Lo people -- I've got 20 submissions for the profile sheet thus far; the range of both the musical styles and the personalities expressed in the profiles is really something else. I'm going to start compiling the list this weekend, and send the initial batch off to Kim probably around Sunday (perhaps later, depending on time...) So if you want to be included in the charter run of the index, be sure to mail me your profile before the weekend. Thanks again to everyone who's contributed thus far. I think you'll all get a real kick out of the result; I'll post the index to the list once it's compiled. Bye for now, --Andre Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 15:20:35 -0300 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias) Subject: Re: Plex Pricing Collier Hyams wrote: >>matthias and olivier. >>tupkal is the achronym ... Ray helped: >I think they were wondering about the "shoot my wad" idiom that you so >skillfully employed. ;-) Yes, I did not feel like asking again, but continue curious to learn. I can teach you some swiss or portugese "idioms", if you like - off list ;-) It was "blow my wad in a lump" and >what do the calartians have for machines now? web space and such? would it be >possible to use some of that? rippy(rpi) has relatively cheap per meg rates, >but my program is super intensive and may not have enough hours per carpeyed >diem. Thanks Matthias Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 15:20:31 -0300 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com From: matthias@bahianet.com.br (Matthias) Subject: Re: sustainor >I read in a Hamer Guitars catalog that one of their strat shaped metal >sort of guitars has a sustainor built in. That would probably be a >better instrument than some of the lower end guitars that has this >feature built in. > >Todd Madson. The Fernandez guitars I have seen were better than the Hamer guitars I have seen. Is that still a list topic? Matthias Date: 02 Oct 96 16:11:17 EDT From: Teed Rockwell <74164.3703@CompuServe.COM> To: "INTERNET:Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com" Subject: Re: Amplification Mathias writes: If you have an ideal, the copy never comes close enough. If you talk yourself into wanting to find out the ways of expression in a cheap, handy, versatile gear, you may find that there are more than you had, allthough all different. It means relearning the instrument, maybe? Or even disconnect from the sound tradition (of the 60ies)? I would love to be proven wrong about this, but you should realise that I tried talking myself into exactly that position for almost 20 years. I am not an anti-transistor luddite who refused to even consider the possibility you mention. In fact I use a digital reverb-delay as a supplement to the tube sound, to get both digital brittleness and tube warmth. Part of it maybe that the stick, not having a body, needs that extra tube tone. There may be something to your comment about my being connected to the sixties. When I first played my stick through a fender twin, I realised that I hadn't heard that sound since I gave up playing guitar 22 years ago, and that I had not sounded that good since. (My original Fender twin was accidentally set on fire by a Hendrix clone friend of mine who wrapped tin foil around the fuse after it blew out) All of of these choices are highly individual, though. I'm not trying to convert anybody, just to add my voice to the multitude Teed Rockwell P.S. attention all loopers: please sign your posts. I get no headings when I receive them, and have no other way of identifying you. From: pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu (Paolo Valladolid) Subject: Re: Amplification To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 14:29:21 -0700 (PDT) > I would love to be proven wrong about this, but you should realise that I > tried talking myself into exactly that position for almost 20 years. I am not an > anti-transistor luddite who refused to even consider the possibility you > mention. In fact I use a digital reverb-delay as a supplement to the tube sound, > to get both digital brittleness and tube warmth. Part of it maybe that the > stick, not having a body, needs that extra tube tone. [snip] > Teed Rockwell Why not have both? That is, the full-range setup _and_ the tube tone? A number of well-known players have insisted that the tube amp sound requires not only preamp tubes but power tubes as well. So what if you want the full-range sound of modern effects/looping devices but still crave that tube warmth? As far as I am aware, there are two workable types of solutions: 1. Tube head as preamp. Plug the speaker out into something like a Holdsworth Harness, a device that converts the signal from teh speaker out to a line level signal. Now you can use this signal for processing. If you like, split the signal so that you have one "pure" signal path and another for processing. 2. Small tube amp as preamp. Mic it into your mixer then use your mixer's effect loop(s) for processing. Why a small amp? Basically it's just for better portability and being able to get the overdrive you want without damaging your hearing. Again, maybe you want to split the signal for parallel processing. This way you have 100% of the tube amp sound _and_ the full-range setup. Use the full-range setup to get the volume you need. If you're lucky enough to be gigging at a venue with a decent in-house PA, all you will need is your little amp/head and your effects setup. Again, just a thought. Paolo Valladolid ----------------------------------------------------------------- |Moderator of Digital Guitar Digest, an Internet mailing list |\ |for Music Technology and Stringed Instruments | \ ----------------------------------------------------------------- | \ finger pvallado@waynesworld.ucsd.edu for more info \ | \ http://waynesworld.ucsd.edu/DigitalGuitar/home.html \| ----------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 15:46:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: A life of its own (was Re: Vortex Loops Using Deja Vu B) "Louis Collier Hyams" writes: >ray, >have you used ebow in the past? Nope, that's why I'm askin'! Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 19:24:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Plex Pricing Matthias writes: > Collier Hyams wrote: >>>matthias and olivier. >>>tupkal is the achronym ... > >Ray helped: >>I think they were wondering about the "shoot my wad" idiom that you so >>skillfully employed. ;-) > >Yes, I did not feel like asking again, but continue curious to learn. I'll tell you that it's a phrase not often uttered in mixed company. Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 19:27:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Ray Peck To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Amplification >P.S. attention all loopers: please sign your posts. I get no headings when I >receive them, and have no other way of identifying you. Sorry, but everyone else in the world does. Please learn how to configure your reader. From: "Louis Collier Hyams" To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Plex Pricing the phrase wasnot meant that way. up here (NYC) mixed company is not an expression commonly used. it simply meant that I don't have the money to blow on an incomplete(to my satisfaction) product. ie spend it all in a lump ray, I was attempting not to insult your intelligence by reasking if you had used an ebow... maybe it was a new defective model? it does happen collier From: "Louis Collier Hyams" Date: Wed, 2 Oct 1996 23:55:02 -0400 To: Loopers-Delight@annihilist.com Subject: Re: Amplification chill manrayogram